Episode 217

We have another great opportunity to sit down and talk with missionaries! In this episode, we are talking with Zach and Sarah Smith, missionaries to American Samoa. If you are anything like Jay, the only thing you might know about American Samoa are the famous people that originate or descend from there, like Tulsi Gabbard or Dwayne Johnson. There is so much more to the territory than its celebrities, of course, like the more than 50,000 souls that currently live there. Many of them would say they are Christian, but they do not have a personal relationship with Christ. These are the ones with whom Zach and Sarah would like to share the gospel. You will get to hear about God’s call on both their individual lives and their life as a married couple, the work that has yet to be done in American Samoa, and what God is doing there right now. Could God be moving you to partner with them in the work?

[Sarah]

And long before we even, it gives me chills to even talk about it, long before we even knew we were going to be missionaries to American Samoa, the Lord was instilling us a love for the Samoan people.

[Jay]

Thank you for tuning in to the Removing Barriers podcast. I’m Jay and I’m MCG. And we’re attempting to remove barriers so we can all have a clear view of the cross.

[MCG]

This is episode 217 of the Removing Barriers podcast. And this is the 24th in the series of On the Mission Field. And in this episode, we’ll be going on the mission field with missionaries Zach and Sarah Smith to the American Samoa. Zach, Sarah, it is indeed a pleasure. Welcome to the Removing Barriers podcast.

[Zach]

Thank you so much. We’re excited to be here.

[Sarah]

Thank you for having us.

[MCG]

And Sarah, a special welcome to you because I think it’s becoming a trend now. But when we started on the mission field, we only had their husband, but now the wives are more wanting to do this more. So a special welcome to you.

[Sarah]

Thank you. I’m super outgoing, so it’s not really hard for me to talk.

[Jay]

Awesome.

[MCG]

Well, that’s good. You’re my wife alike.

[Jay]

Hi, this is Jay. MCG and I would like for you to help us remove barriers by going to removingbarriers.net and subscribing to receive all things Removing Barriers. If you’d like to take your efforts a bit further and help us keep the mics on, consider donating at removingbarriers.net/donate. Removing Barriers: A Clear View of the Cross.

[MCG]

All right, so Sarah, let’s start with you since they say ladies first. Tell us about yourself, your calling, your family, and maybe kind of bring us up to how you and Zach kind of meet and all this gets started. Then we’ll come to you, Zach.

[Sarah]

Okay, so I am one of five children and I was raised in a Christian home and I was taken to church whether I wanted to go or not. And so we grew up, my parents both graduated from Bible school and started their early lives in the ministry, just serving like a church plant help. then later on just kind of became faithful members of a church. And not that my dad was never a pastor, nothing, but super faithful and kept us in the church and plugged in, put us in Christian school so that way we could be immersed in the gospel almost. And I am number four out of five kids. And I was born in Columbus, Ohio, and then we moved to Dayton, Ohio when I was about in second grade. And we were in another church in this area while I was young. And then about teenage years, we started coming to our home church, which is now our sending church, Cornerstone Baptist So I was raised here as a teenager and they dealt with a lot. Let me tell you, I was not an easy teen to be dealt with. And I thought I was saved at a young age at home. And later on at a youth camp as a young teenager, I decided that I didn’t really know for sure if I was saved and I didn’t want to take that chance going with that doubt. So at a youth camp, I made sure of my salvation. Just make sure I trusted in the Lord and what the Bible says, to put in your faith through Jesus, Jesus alone. And then after that, I felt a call to missions at a young age, but at a youth camp, felt a call to missions, told my parents about it, vaguely told our singles pastor about it at the time, and never really made that a, I guess, requirement for myself. And me and Zach grew up in the youth group together as friends. never really dating until after high school. And I knew he was called into the ministry, but never really knew about missions and really didn’t even bring it up. I was just available as that’s what God had for me. And then later on, obviously, that’s what happened. But yeah, that’s how me and Zach met at church, the youth group. And through our single, we call it the singles class, but it’s like college and career age class. So we met there, and we were actually both dating separate people at the time, and then just were friends. really random. It’s not like weird, but it does sound weird when you say it. My brother married his sister. So my sister married brother and sister.

[Jay]

Right.

[Sarah]

So we figured we might as well have two in the family if we already had one. So that’s how we kind of ended up by default, first friends and then fell in love with each other, still learning to love each other after all these years.

[MCG]

And your kids are double cousins.

[Sarah]

Yes, our kids are double first cousins. Yes. So see, you know.

[MCG]

I have a few in my family.

[Sarah]

Okay. Yeah. Some people are like, oh my, aren’t you related? I’m like, no. So yeah. The devil first cousins for my brother’s and his sister’s kids and our kids. So we love that. It’s fun.

[Jay]

Wonderful.

[Sarah]

Do you want me to go into the marriage part now or?

[MCG]

You can let Zach tell us his part.

[Zach]

So I was raised in a Christian home as well. My grandparents were actually missionaries to Germany. While my mom was over there with them, my dad was stationed there. That’s how my parents met. And so then he got stationed back here in Dayton, Ohio at an Air Force base here. And so we ended up at Cornerstone. From when I was first born, I was at Cornerstone here. And like she said, we met at church. At 16 years of age, she realized that I wasn’t saved. And I had heard the gospel a lot of times. but just realized that I wasn’t for sure that I was saved. And so got an assurance of my salvation, November of 2006, and since then, just known for sure that God was wanting me to just serve him. And about three years later, knew that God was calling me to preach at a youth camp. And so I surrendered to that. And like Sarah said, she didn’t really make it a for sure thing that I had to go to the mission field. I didn’t really even know totally about that from her, but like she said, we were friends and then just one thing led to another. And so after about four years of dating, we got married. And we had five kids. We started plugging into the church wherever we could. I started working on the bus ministry, different things, youth camps and Vacation Bible School. And then we really started to grow more when we were in the young adults class. And so then years later, after we got married, we had an opportunity to transition from helping in the youth group down to the young adults class. And we did that for about the last eight years before we knew God was calling us to be missionaries. But we loved it because it just gave us a chance to be able to to reach people when we were, really at a time where you kind of decide, after the youth group, it’s kind of your choice, whether you go to church or not. So we really enjoyed being able to pour into that. And God gave us five kids. And so we have a 11 year old, nine year old, seven-year old, four year old and two year old. And they’re fun. They are fun.

[Jay]

Amazing. That’s one.

[MCG]

We won’t accident date of birth because most fathers don’t know that fine details.

[Zach]

Yeah, I don’t know. By the time I get to the fifth one, I might be way off. I even mess it up.

[Jay]

Well, can you tell us, you talked about your marriage and you talked about being saved when you were around teenager age. But if I could just go back to Sarah for just one moment, this is always a question that I find interesting. When someone mentions that they made a profession of faith when they were younger and then realized when they were maybe teenage age that per, hey, I’m not sure if I’m saved. What was it that caused you to question whether or not you were saved? Was it the fact that you saw no fruit? or maybe you just didn’t remember when you made a profession, or was it the sermon that you heard that made you start to reevaluate things? What was it that caused you to realize, hey, I might not actually be saved?

[Sarah]

Okay. That’s a good question because I feel like that is something that a lot more people then we talk about maybe deal with and struggle with. And I think for me, it was maybe I would not outcast doubt because I think I was doubting some, I guess. And maybe some of it was false doubts, which I think people do deal with some too. But for me, it was more of like I was four or five when supposedly I made a profession of faith and I knew that. I guess I was told I made a profession of faith, and I’m not blaming my parents because obviously they saw me do it. Sure. But I really couldn’t remember that time. And it was over a series of messages where it was mentioned several times. If you’re not sure, if you don’t remember a time where you called on the Lord to save you, then you could do all the right things and you could go to every church service and you could be serving. But if you really have never called on the Lord to save you, then you’re really not saved. And so I think I just struggle with that. And to be honest, I don’t know. I know for sure from that day on, without a shadow of doubt, I’ve really never doubted it again. But so people always ask that and I don’t really know if maybe I was, maybe the Lord had already saved me at five, but I couldn’t go on without getting that settled and settling it. Maybe the settling was more of just clearing my doubts away. Or if it was just saying like, Lord, this is the day that I am calling on you. I don’t remember that day before and I’m settling. And I’ve seen pastor’s wives do that before. I’ve seen people do it. I think people do struggle with that. And my encouragement would be, it doesn’t matter when you do it, as long as you do it. Absolutely. Jesus wants you to be saved, whether you’re little, old, whatever. So if you are really struggling, maybe counsel with your pastor or something about it. And I would encourage someone to keep seeking the Lord on that issue for sure.

[Jay]

Would you say that’s the same thing for you too, Zach?

[Zach]

Yeah, I think I remembered that it happened. I remembered like someone telling me, hey, you were this age. But we actually had, I think it was, I didn’t go to the school here at our church, we had a Christian school, but I was pretty involved. A lot of my friends went, so I would hear about different things going on. And there was actually, I believe, a really just moving chapel service and like seven or eight people that I knew and thought were saved really came forward and got saved or got assurance of their salvation and started to think to myself, Is it okay for me to just believe that I was saved or do I want to know for sure? And I really called my youth pastor and just told him like, this is what I’m feeling. And he said, well, there’s nothing that you need to do right now than to ask Jesus Christ to be your savior because you don’t want to wonder if you are for sure. You want to know for sure. And ever since then, I mean, I haven’t been perfect. I think all of us can say I haven’t been perfect since we got saved. But like Sarah said, I haven’t had any doubts since then that I wasn’t for sure that I’m on my way to heaven, which, you know, really the best thing for me was hearing that my pastor had a similar thing. And he never shied away from telling that when he was younger, he thought that he had been saved. But when he was a teenager, he made for sure, like made it a definite thing that he asked you to send to his heart. And so that helps when leadership, somebody that cares about you can kind of admit that, then I knew for sure that if I had doubts that I need to know for sure. And I’m glad I did.

[MCG]

Amen. Yeah, definitely. Curious question. How are you guys guarding this in your own children? As you say, it’s pretty common for someone who’s born in a Christian home at a young age, made a profession, and then had teenagers, they probably doubt a little bit and probably most likely no fault of the parent is a normal course of life where, you know, as they try to make the fate their own. Are you guys doing anything with the way you’re raising your kids in terms of like prevent this from happening?

[Zach]

Do you want me to go first? Yeah, go ahead.

[Sarah]

I feel like that’s a great thought because that was something that happens a lot in Christian homes where they’re immersed in the gospel or maybe immersed in the church. So I think really just living it out a day-to-day life, and I don’t ever like press it with them. I want them to come with a conviction from the Holy Spirit and I want them to understand it on their own. So my oldest two came at like the most, like awkward times. And that’s how I feel like it was really sincere. Now, obviously, we teach them what the Bible says and teach them about people being saved. And we actively, when we pray each night with the kids, we actively pray for the salvation of the little boys who aren’t saved yet in our family. And my daughter, Charlotte, she’s seven. She’s made a profession, but I don’t know if she’s fully grasped it. And so sometimes the older siblings getting saved make them say like, I gotta be saved. So we’re just trying to let, I feel like letting the Holy Spirit really guide there is very important. And just praying for the Holy Spirit to move in that way. So it’s not just us putting it on them, it’s them coming with the conviction of the Holy Spirit.

[Zach]

Yeah, we had a real life example of that. I mean, our oldest, I thought she was saved before we went on and started deputation. And it was one of our first meetings, even before we went full-time in deputation, we were at a church service. And I remember the pastor got up and was preaching and she went down and she got saved. And I could have said, well, I thought you were saved already, but I just said, that’s a great decision. And honestly, if we only went on deputation to be missionaries so that she could get assurance of our salvation, I mean, we talked about it that night, it would have been And she’s had, I think she’s a little bit more like intuitive. She understands more things that are going on. And so there will be times where she asks, how do you know for sure? How do you know you’re going to heaven? How do you? And we try to answer those questions as best we can and give her biblical examples. I mean, I think there’s going to be throughout your younger and teenage years, I think there’s just going to be times where you doubt. I mean, our son is really hard on himself, our oldest son, when he messes up, when he sins, And so I would think some people when they do that could think, I’m not saved. Well, that doesn’t mean you’re not saved, but it’s good to remind them, you know, you’re a Christian. We want to do what’s right. And when we don’t, you know, we ask God to forgive us. We move on. Doesn’t mean you’re not saved anymore, but we try to just give them some understanding without, like Sarah said, just like making them or telling them that that’s what happened. Kind of want them to say it on their own and remember. and be confident in that.

[Jay]

Amen. Well, you mentioned deputation. How long ago was it when you were on deputation and how long has you been on the mission field?

[Zach]

Okay, so we’re 21 months into deputation. So we’re technically not in American Samoa yet. So we’re not really officially on the mission field, but we are, like I said, 21 months into deputation. Actually, we leave in about three weeks, me and Sarah, oh, two weeks, sorry, two weeks from today, we leave to go to American Samoa and we’re gonna be trying to find out how Sarah didn’t get to go on the initial initial survey trips. It’ll be great for her to be there. And so we’re going to look for a house that we can rent and just kind of see some other stuff that to be just completely honest, as a guy, I probably would overlook. But having her there, she’ll kind of know the things, hey, this is available to us, this isn’t, and just kind of make more of a game plan about things we need to take, things we can get there and different stuff like that.

[MCG]

All right. We have mentioned Americans are more. Where on the globe is this? Where do you find it?

[Zach]

So it’s in a place in the world that’s considered Oceania, is what it’s called, which is technically not an actual continent or anything like that. The best way to describe it is we always tell people it’s halfway between Hawaii and New Zealand. So if you get to Hawaii on a map and you go southwest, basically, right after you get under the equator, as you’re going towards New Zealand, you’ll come to American Samoa, Samoa. There’s some other islands near there, Guam, Fiji. So out in that area of the world, It’s basically as close as you can get to the international dateline without being the next day.

[MCG]

Wow.

[Jay]

Okay, so when I hear American Samoa, I have to confess, I don’t know a lot about it. I think of very famous actors like The Rock and- The Rock. There’s the other guy with the long hair, I forget his name, but then there’s a famous wrestler from there too. So you see, I’m only familiar with American Samoa when it comes to like celebrities. I don’t know anything about the country or anything about the territory, anything about it at all. Can you tell us what is American Samoa? Is it a country? Is it a territory? What are the people like there? Tell us a little bit more about American Samoa.

[Zach]

Yeah, so American Samoa is an American territory. To my knowledge, there’s five American territories. And if you live there, you’re considered what is a national. So you’re not an American citizen, but you’re not an immigrant, if you will. So a lot of the people there are going to look like, if you’ve ever seen the movie Moana, they’re going to have that type of skin color. They’re going to look that way. That was based almost totally off of Samoan culture. And so it’s an island, it’s very warm. I tell people it has two seasons hot and then hotter. And it’s a beautiful area, but it’s got its own culture, which is strange to think about when you think it’s an American territory. But if anybody that’s been to another country or is from another country would be able to tell people more. When you’re from America, you think, well, I know everything about America. I know we have people that aren’t even from America in America, so I understand culture. But until you go to a different place, you don’t understand that culture is actually just a totally different thing. And what kind of messes that up for American Samoa too, they speak English predominantly. They use the American dollar. So they have a lot of things that tie them so closely with America that when people go there, I don’t even think they realize that they’re stepping into a totally different culture.

[Sarah]

The people there, very warm, very friendly. very welcoming, like probably give you a hug first time you meet them kind of people. Right. And just like overwhelming, outgoing and just they treat you like family. And that’s long story. Maybe we’ll get into this, but my best friend’s mom’s from American Samoa. And so that’s why we even know more about it than the average person would.

[Jay]

Right, right.

[Sarah]

And they have always treated me. They’re like my second family. They call me basically. And that’s how they are. And once they, accept you as that, they accept you. Once they love you, they love you.

[MCG]

Yeah. Give us the religious breakdown of the American Samoa. Maybe you can also get into what’s the capital city, the population like and stuff like that.

[Zach]

Sure. So their capital is a place called Pongo Pongo, but it’s spelled P-A-G-O-P-A-G-O. It’s not a very big capital. The whole territory is only 78 square miles. So about the size of Washington, DC.

[Jay]

Oh, wow.

[Zach]

And they have about 50,000 people, give or take, on the island at all times, a little bit more during the holiday season and summer, a little bit less during the school year. And when you think about it, you think more of like, I don’t know, American Samoa is really, as far as The breakdown of the religious side, they would be what you consider a Christian area, a Christian nation, if you will. But most of that would be works-based salvation. So there’s a ton of religion there, even for how small it is. Really every major religion I know of outside of like some Buddhism, some Islam. But if you think about, you know, just a random place in the United States that you drive through, you see a bunch of churches, they would have all those churches, Assemblies of God, Mormon, Jehovah’s Witness, any type of Protestant would be there. It’s hard to even name how many are there. A very few Baptist churches, the gospel’s not new to that area of the world, but when it first came there, it really endured some changes right away to where the pure gospel was changed more to a works-based salvation. And so a lot of those people are super religious. They’d invite you to their church. They love God, but they really don’t have a relationship with them.

[Jay]

So you’re hoping to go there and share the true gospel with them. And it sounds like it shouldn’t be that difficult because these people are warm and open and friendly, right? Or are we missing something there?

[Sarah]

So I think it shouldn’t be that difficult to maybe share it. But getting someone or like having someone receive Christ when they don’t feel like they have the need for Christ, I feel like is going to probably be our biggest challenge in thinking that they already have, you know, Christianity. And, you know, if someone, Samoan’s listening to this, I don’t want them to feel that we’re like categorizing everybody in that. We’re just looking statistically speaking. Statistically speaking, they would have a lot of religion, but I would assume that very few of that is the true knowledge of Jesus Christ, you know, being the only way and alone through salvation.

[Jay]

I was, let me see. I was an adult when I realized that Catholics are not the same as, say, for example, Baptists. I was an adult when I came to realize that. And so I can only imagine if you’re in a territory that’s the size of Washington, D.C., and there’s Mormon and Catholic and all sorts of other influence, how everyone there would say, oh, yeah, I’m a Christian. Yeah, you know. Exactly. So it would be like trying to witness to a religious person, which in many instances is a lot more difficult than witnessing to someone who is. So what is it about American Samoa that drew you to it? When did you begin to feel the burden for American Samoa?

[Sarah]

So my best friends, which Zach’s really close with her too, like she’s probably a mutual best friend with both of us. But my best friend growing up, her mom was from American Samoa.

[Jay]

Right.

[Sarah]

So I never really, until we had been called to the mission field, until we surrendered and felt like we were called, it wasn’t like I thought my whole life, like I’m gonna be a missionary there. You know, I didn’t have no thinking of it. But isn’t it funny how the Lord works when you look back at things in your life. And long before we even, it gives me chills to even talk about it, long before we even knew we were going to be missionaries to American Samoa, the Lord was instilling us a love for the Samoan people, like having no clue. And I told Zach all the time, like I would go, my best friend, they would take me on their family vacation. And in the summer, they would go to Mississippi, and her brother lives in Mississippi. He’s American Samoan, and his wife was from the Philippines. And we would stay there for a week. So getting to know him, I mean, he would give the nieces and nephews money to go to the arcade and he would give me money too. Like, I just felt like I was in their family. Sure. And so growing up, we were really close with them and really close with her. And actually her dad taught with us in the young adults class that we led for eight years. They were our co-teachers as well with another couple. So long before we even knew we were going there, God instilled love for the Samoan people. And looking back now, that was him orchestrating that all along. So when we were called to the mission field, we just mentioned American Samoa. To be honest, we had met with a missionary going to South Africa, and we loved his ministry that was already started there. And I was kind of secretly hoping, like, that would be so awesome. But that just got laid on our heart, and I don’t think it was by accident for sure.

[Jay]

Amazing.

[Zach]

Yeah, I mean, our church has always been super involved in missions. From the time that I can remember wanting to do something more than just attending our church, being able to help, we have our missions conferences and Sarah, same way, a lot of us teenagers would just help with the missionaries when they would have their kids here, even the missionaries showing them where to go and different stuff. And our church has missionaries throughout the year. So we were just really familiar with missionaries and from any parts of the world. So that became kind of, okay, God, we could go anywhere. And our pastor said, I know A lot of pastors say, you could take the gospel anywhere. The whole world needs it. But we really wanted to go where God wanted us to go. And so we had mentioned to our friend’s mom, you know, hey, have you ever seen a missionary to American Samoa? And she really didn’t know of 1. And then we just started asking other missionaries that were sent out of our church. And like my wife said, reaching out to some people that already had ministries. Really, we wanted to go and help somebody that already had an established ministry. We felt like God would allow us to do that. We wanted to be able to help. And so we just started calling around to mission boards and asking them, for help figuring it out or what did they need to do for us to be able to be a part of them and they could help us. And really the only one that would really talk to us more in depth without getting some other things taken care of was our mission board now, which is Baptist International Outreach. And long story short, really, the president of that mission board used to be a missionary to American Samoa. So when I mentioned the places we were thinking of and said American Samoa, obviously that got his ear and he’s like, wow, I used to be a missionary there. I have a friend that’s in that area of the world. I could give you their contact and you could just see where it goes from there. And so I sent that guy an e-mail. 30 minutes later, he calls me and says, you know, we’re transitioning off the field and I’m glad you’re interested in this because there’s still a need for a missionary there. Got me in contact with a pastor that was pastoring a church that was started by a missionary. And so that’s how we took the survey trip there in January of 24. And then once I was there, just being able to see the people and get to know the area and just see all the areas that God’s allowed us to work in our church here, all those ministries are available and open there to be able to have a church, establish a church, and be able to really win people to Christ and whatever God will bring us. But we knew for sure then that that’s where God was calling us.

[Sarah]

And really, it’s cool because, like I said, how God was orchestrating it long before. Just every step of the way, we had considered going with another mission board. And I was having Cam, our youngest at the time, and he would only been like five to six weeks old when they were wanting us to come to the training school where you can basically get, I don’t how they say it, or you signed up to be under their mission. But they had said you can’t bring any children into the training classes. And I understand their take on that because they probably have tons of people with children, so they have to kind of draw the line. But my thought on that was, there’s no way I’m putting my five-week-old baby in a nursery with somebody else for eight hours a day. So I told him I’m doing that as a closed door because being a mother is my primary thing and I’m not comfortable with that. And that just led us to the other mission board where the president so happened used to be a missionary to American Samoa. So it was the Lord. I mean, that’s just the Lord’s day. And I tell people, it was almost like there was dominoes set up and the Lord just pushed it and they just like fell. I know that’s silly to think of it that way, but it’s a kid’s illustration.

[Jay]

Right, But the Lord totally orchestrating it.

[MCG]

Yeah, it’s amazing. And we have interviewed a number of missionaries and I’ve heard similar stories where the Lord has aligned stuff in a way that he can’t say anything else, but it is Lord.

[Sarah]

Exactly. Yep.

[Zach]

Yeah.

[MCG]

What are some things folks should keep in mind if they are called or they felt called to serve the Lord in American Samoa?

[Zach]

So I said already, but it’s hot. And I didn’t necessarily, I’m not against hot or cold. I’ll be sweating if it’s 30 degrees or 100. So it doesn’t matter.

[MCG]

Right.

[Zach]

But it is hot. It’s a different area of the world. Never really cool. But. it is beautiful. And so there’s, you take some of the heat, you get some of the beauty, but also, like Sarah said, they’re super friendly. That was one of our prayers, God, who we are. And so if we can go to a place where people would be willing to, converse with us, be kind, probably going to make us a little bit, I think, maybe better at serving you there. And God knows those little things. And so he worked that out. So I would say it’s a place where you would go and be welcome. Now, they maybe wouldn’t necessarily, the first time he showed the gospel when someone gets saved, but understanding that gives you a little bit, maybe you alter your expectations to know, I didn’t get saved till I was 16, truly. And so I heard the gospel a lot before I accepted it. And so when you think about it in that way, it’s a little easier for you to say, okay, I may not be going to this place and seeing somebody saved the first day I’m there, but this is the way the people are. And God has put me in this place. There’s going to be opportunities to be able to not only be around people, build those relationships. And then we believe that after a certain amount of time, God’s going to bring that. We were just in a missions conference or missions Sunday with a missionary that has been in Brazil for 21 years. And they were mentioning people that after 20 years of hearing the gospel have gotten saved. And also people that after 20 years of hearing the gospel still aren’t saved. And some people might think, man, how could you do that? But for us, it was an encouragement knowing that it doesn’t mean when you first get somewhere that all these people are going to get saved. But after you continue to do what God’s asked you to do, which is just be faithful, that people are going to come to him when it’s their time to come to him. And it was cool to just see the 21 years. I was over 100 souls that they knew for sure had gotten saved. It was all at different times. I think wherever you go, especially for American Samoa, just knowing that the expectations, just because somebody doesn’t get saved every day, doesn’t mean that you’re not where God has called you to be.

[Sarah]

I would say along those lines, keeping in mind that our pastor always said this and it’s always stuck with me, people don’t care how much you know until they know how much you care. And I would say just caring for those people and being sincere and being friendly and actually loving them as people like Christ would love them is going to speak way more volume than throwing a Bible at them. And I’m not saying, you know, we shouldn’t use the Bible, obviously, but I’m thinking, you know, they want to know that you’re sincere. that you’re genuine and that you actually care. And I also think if someone was wanting to go serve there, just really being sensitive, I feel like, to the Holy Spirit for any field, obviously, and just being sensitive to the Lord and that, and just trying to keep your motives pure and your heart pure. Because sometimes people just get crazy about saying, you know, X, Y, and Z got saved and X, Y, and Z got baptized. And it’s like, that’s good and all, but it’s like, it’s not just about, you know, the numbers per se. It’s about, you know what I’m saying? Right. And so I would say like along those lines, yeah, just keeping your expectations reality basically, but also letting the Lord guide those too.

[Zach]

And they should also know we’re actively praying for people to come and be in American Samoa. So God might be working on their heart because of our prayers.

[Sarah]

Right.

[Zach]

And you’re gonna have an opportunity to be in a place that is different than some places. You can get into American Samoa with just your US passport. You can go to American Samoa and not have to worry maybe so much about some things you’re worried about in some mission deals where You don’t know if you can eat the food. They have everything available that you would have here and you have access to things. They have a US post office. So some of those things are, positive things, positive things, especially just in terms of mission trips. There’s a lot of people that may look to those type of things and say, man, I could at least go and see. Maybe if God could use me somewhere by seeing this field.

[Jay]

Now, you mentioned earlier that there is a little bit of a different culture there. We would expect, if we hear American Samoa, we would expect a little bit of that American culture there. But you talked about how it was a little bit different. Can you elucidate those differences in culture and how that might affect your ministry going in? I know you haven’t really been there yet, but you have had a lot of interaction with the people, with your mutual friend there. What are some of the cultural things that you anticipate the differences in culture that you anticipate that might create, I don’t want to say a problem, but it just might make ministering a little bit different. And how do you plan to handle those differences? So.

[Zach]

I would say the biggest emphasis we have before even going there, and we’ve heard other missionaries say the same thing, we’re not going there to like bring America there. We’re there to bring the gospel. And so we really want to take time. And I think this is where some people miss out on the goal of a missionary. It’s not going to be the first day we’re there. Everybody is just coming. I would love for the whole to get saved the first day we’re there. that’d be great. But we’re going there as Americans. We love America. I have nothing against America. I love this country, but we’re going there to take the gospel to them, not to make them better Americans. We want them to get saved. And so the differences I would say is they’re more family oriented. So like they’re going to care what their family thinks. They’re going to care what their family’s doing. And so sometimes that can be a great thing because if somebody in the family gets saved, they can influence someone else to get saved. But also it can be a barrier where you think, If I get saved, if I change the way that my family’s always believed, then are they even going to want me to be in the family anymore? And there’s just other things too. A lot of things you think about, man, it’s an island. It’s a beautiful place. Who wouldn’t want to live there? Well, that’s for people like us that have lived not on an island for our whole life. When you go there, you actually meet a lot of people that are dying to get off the island. They’re figuring out ways. And that’s why a lot of people join the US military from there. It’s an easy path to citizenship. Like you said, there’s been actors, famous actors, famous wrestlers. Now there’s a lot of football players. Troy Palomali was a football player years ago that got money back there and has done a lot for his community. And people see that and they think, okay, well, I could go and make that money too. And they still care everything about that. If you talk to Samoan people now that are famous, They still care a lot about that culture and it’s just that’s why it’s different. They’re just more of a close-knit people and they’re not going to forget about those things no matter what happens. And so.

[Sarah]

Some other things might include not so much as spiritual, but maybe just, you know, their day-to-day would be. Like their weddings are like a huge thing. And the best friend that I was just telling you, I was my best friend. She just got married in August of this year. She actually did like a special Samoan, like cultural dance during her reception. And she like got a Samoan gown. It’s like a ritual thing that they do. I guess it was beautiful. Yeah. So they do that. Graduations, huge ordeal. Let’s see, funerals, huge ordeal. When Zach was there, they had the, the governor’s mom passed away. And so they like shut down school for her future. year old, it was a big ordeal. And another difference, which we don’t know a lot about this besides what we know, they bury their dead in their yard, in like their front yard. Now, what we know about it, it’s not that’s like worship the dead or nothing. but they want to keep their family close. And there’s not a lot of cemeteries on the land because it’s mostly mountainous and then there’s a coastline. So it’s not like they have tons of space to just put cemeteries everywhere.

[Jay]

Right. So.

[Sarah]

They actually bury with a tombstone, like you’ll see a big tombstone in the yard, it’s in their front yard. So, but they really, they love their family. And I can appreciate that because I’m very close with my family. Like we’re very close with an extended family as well.

[Jay]

Absolutely.

[Sarah]

But like he said, that could be a burial.

[Jay]

Quick question, this is probably just a little bit of a rabbit trail, but with the proximity to New Zealand, is there the Maori culture, is that one and the same or is that something different?

[Zach]

No, it would be different. And that’s kind of a good thing to think about. Each one of those island nations, while they’ll be similar looking, some of the people may be similar, some cultural things may be similar. They would definitely tell you that they’re not the same as those, as you know, Maori people or the Fijian people, all those things. For us, you think of that area of the world, you think there’s a lot of similarities, but each one of their cultures, I think, is what separates them, obviously, probably because of their distance in the ocean, stuff like that. A lot of people think Hawaii is similar to American Samoa, too. And while there are a lot of similarities, one thing is it’s six hours away on a flight. So it’s technically the closest American place to it. But other than that, it’s really not as similar as some people would say. And then you have American Samoa and you have Samoa that’s 40 miles away and it’s its own country. Now, people in American Samoa consider themselves Samoan. But if you ask people in Samoa, they say, well, they’re not Samoan, they’re American Samoan. So there’s even that, you know, just in the 40 miles of ocean, there’s even that just big, hey, we’re not the same.

[Jay]

So very distinct cultures, very distinct way of looking at themselves. And okay, gotcha. Yeah.

[MCG]

Oh, since my wife decided to go on a rabbit train. Sorry. Let me ask one of my own. Do they do the hacker there on the American Samoa?

[Zach]

So they would do something similar. I think The Rock may have had something like that in a movie. Sometimes I hear stuff from people and I try to piece it together, but I believe he did something like that in one of his movies. And so they you have that, like my wife said, they did a specific dance, even so much as this girl that we know, her family has their own pattern that they make clothing out of that’s unique to that family in American Samoa. And then there would be different to their other chiefs. And that’s kind of how the land has been split and how the culture has been split in that way. They’re all the same, but they’re different because of those different, things that they wear and just how they are in that way. But it would be similar to the Hakka. They have some of those dances. To my knowledge, it’s not anything about their worshiping, spirits or, nature, different stuff like that, but it’s just something that they’ve held on to culturally that they do for traditional things.

[MCG]

So the obvious question will be, are you going to be learning it?

[Zach]

I’ll do my best. I’ll do my best. I’ll try my best to have a part in whatever dance they would allow me to learn. I know like the family that we keep referencing, they’ve had some family reunions here in the States where they get a lot of people together and they’ve done a lot of those things to keep, you know, culturally together. Again, I referenced Moana before. A lot of it can be seen in there because they consulted actual Samoan people to try to be as, you know, as authentic as they could. So a lot of that stuff you would see and be like, oh, like we have a hook. that looks just like Maui’s hook on our table and I bought it in Samoa. So it’s those similar things that definitely we’ll try to do as much of that as we can. You know, obviously, you know, everybody may not like the haka dance, but I’ll do my best. Someone asked me if I knew when I was going to do it at a church and I told them no.

[Sarah]

He was on stage. We were doing a question and answer and they’re like, can you do the haka dance? He was like, not today.

[MCG]

All right. So Would you say that the culture in the American Samoa is more of a Acts chapter 2 or more of a Acts chapter 17 culture?

[Zach]

So I would say Acts 17, while it’s not totally that way, it’s more of they have so many religions that you’re trying to, you know, really enable them to understand that I’m not trying to change who you are as a person. You know, you can have those things that are about you, but they really do need to know that while it’s good that you go to church, while it’s good that you’re moral, there is is one way to heaven. And so for them, understanding that, it’s kind of a thing that you hear sometimes in life, too, like you said, people be like, are you Christian? Yeah, I’m Catholic. Or are you Christian? Yeah, I’m Seventh-day Adventist. Now, I don’t know. I took some religion classes at the college I went to, and I understood it a little bit, obviously, the major differences in some of the world religions. But some of the Protestant religions and things that are like that, there are some similarities to what we believe. But if they’re not believing in Jesus Christ to get them to heaven, then all of those things aren’t going to matter to help you do anything anyway. But it doesn’t necessarily mean you have to destroy what they’ve always believed in. You just want them to understand that it’s not me telling you this. It’s the word of God. And so when you believe that, you know, it’s more freeing than it is the religion telling you to do this, and this, and then maybe you’ll be good enough to get to heaven. So I would say it’s mainly more Acts 17 than Acts 2, for sure.

[Jay]

Now, what are some things, if you’d like to share with those that are listening and with us, what are some things, some needs that if they were filled, would make your job or your desire to share the gospel in American Samoa easier?

[Zach]

I guess for me, I would say that maybe going back to thinking more of understanding the different cultural things, that it would be great if we had more people to come help. I say that because if you have more people, then you have the ability for, I think, especially if you’re like-minded, and we would say that people that believe that you’re going to heaven, they would be like-minded like us. And if they’re coming to help, then you can just have more people to be able to share that. Obviously, we know that the only way to get to heaven is through Jesus. And so if you’re sharing it and we have a good group of people that are going about it, then we can establish a church. You can establish once you get a church established, you can try to get some kind of Bible college established where you can train pastors. So I would say having more people and having more avenues for them to be able to be trained and then be able to, obviously, our goal is to start a church and then be able to hand it off to someone in American Samoa for two reasons. One, they know the people and two, they’re going to be way more passionate about it. And so being able to have that opportunity to know that a church is behind you and then they’re sending more laborers to fill that need, that would probably be the thing would make it easier, I would say, for American Samoa to be reached in that way. What would you say?

[Jay]

Before you answer that, Sarah, real quick. So the missionary couple that emailed you within 30 minutes of emailing them when you were first thinking about American Samoa, you’re not going to take over their work. You’re going to establish a new work. Yes.

[Zach]

Yeah.

[Jay]

In American Samoa. Okay, gotcha. So more laborers would be what you say to reach the people. Okay. All right. What about you?

[Sarah]

So, yeah, so I’m just going to piggyback off what you just said. So yeah, they’re transitioning up their church that they started years ago is already being pastored by a national Samoan. Oh, okay. And when we go there, we’re friendly with him and he housed that while he was there. So we’re actually going to try to meet up with him when we’re there in a couple of weeks and probably attend one of their services as well. But our plans are not to really. It’s kind of theirs. And so we don’t want them feeling like a missionary is coming in to, you know, take over what, you know what I’m saying?

[Jay]

Gotcha.

[Sarah]

So our goal is to start something new. So I would say that is definitely because another quote that I always hear is like, many hands make light work. Sure. And I’m thinking for personal reasons and for spiritual reasons, personally, it would be nice to have co-laborers to. to lean on and have a bond with being 6,000 miles away from home. And that would be nice. And then also, if there was times where we had to come off the field, that’s going to be a big feat for us when we do have to come back for furlough for times, because then you work so hard to build up a church plant or just start a ministry. And then if you have to leave for six to 10 months or something, then it’s like, what do you do during that time if no one’s there to keep it rolling? So that would definitely be, and then what was it again?

[Zach]

The needs. I think it would be understanding the culture we’ve talked about already. But the best way I think that I’ve heard from other missionaries and just people that know other cultures, if we could understand the language now, like I said before, they speak English predominantly. There’s people there that would prefer to speak Samoan. And also you learn more about a culture when you know their language. You understand some of the things that they do that you would never understand unless you know their language. And so if we can grasp the language, which there’s a way for us to learn the language out of college there. And we’re hoping to do that. And then being able to be plugged into a church that actually, we’ve actually been praying the whole time. God, if you’ll just, like she said, open doors, close doors, let us know what the plan is. And we know he wants us to start a church. But also, like she said, having friends and people that are like-minded as us, you know, we’re going to a place we don’t know anybody really, but we’ve already had people reach out to us just through having a website and through knowing that we’re going to American Samoa, that when we go there here soon, I’ve already met them in the States here and talk to them a little bit. There’s another church there that we’re hoping to be a part of when we first go there to have a place to worship, obviously. And they also want us to do some things in an English speaking way to help their ministry that’s already started, which for us is great. We know we have a place to be at. And so we’re praying that meeting and everything that goes with that goes well so that they know that we want to start a church. They know that God’s put that on our heart and they’re willing to help us really identify a place that would be the best maybe going forward to start the church where we’re not taking people from from their congregation necessarily, but it’s in a place of need where people could be, wanting to go there.

[Sarah]

You definitely don’t want to step on the island and start offending some moments. And that would be the worst thing we could do. So our prayer is for one, the Lord to guide us and two, for us to be sensitive to, you know, this is their land, we’re coming in. And so not to jump to the gun and like say like, oh, we’re the missionaries, we’re doing this, we’re doing this. Well, it’s like, step back a little bit, maybe learn from the people and then make a move, if that makes sense.

[MCG]

Yeah, definitely. That’s definitely the right attitude. This question is going to seem weird, but is there anything the church in the US are currently doing that will make your mission more difficult?

[Zach]

Sarah’s already kind of touched on it and we’ve kind of touched on it a little bit, but the focus kind of of some churches, and it’s not like this in every church we go to, and I even understand why it’s like this, but the focus on the numbers, how many people have gotten saved, how many people have gotten baptized, how many churches have you started? Well, let me just be honest. I want every person in the whole world to get saved. I want all 8 billion. We all want that. But we do know that sometimes it takes longer or it takes different things that you do and spend time doing for people to come to know Jesus Christ. I’m thankful for every missionary where they go, but it’s just different in areas. And I think sometimes churches lump all those things together and it can make difficult. It can make missionaries not maybe be able to get supported because they’re going to a place that people don’t even have confidence that people are going to be saved. So they don’t want to maybe support them in that way. Also, we’ve talked about it already, but the love of country. We love America. We really love it. But when you go to some places in other countries, You can identify the Americans right away because of maybe how loud they are, just different things. And I’m an American that’s loud, so I can say that. But we don’t want so much of a focus to be on how much we love America and forget that we’re not going there to bring more people to America. We’re really going there so that not only the people there can be saved, but just maybe, and we have this heart as we’re going around raising support on deputation. If a church doesn’t support us, maybe there’s just a person in that church, or even if they do support us, a person in that church that hears a message or hears something and God breaks their heart and calls them to the mission field or the people that we’re going to reach, they go and they’re going to be a missionary in another country because of the ministry that has been started. So really, I think if churches can understand it’s not just a flat line that if somebody doesn’t get saved, that that ministry has failed, that doesn’t mean that you don’t try to do your best as a missionary. But churches understanding that evaluating people in the same way in different ministries can make it, for some people, especially if they’re not focused on the right thing, they hear somebody didn’t get saved and they might think, Well, we should stop supporting that missionary because a couple people got saved in this other spot. And so that can make, I think, harder sometimes on missionaries. We haven’t even been there yet, but I know some missionaries can maybe feel like a bunch of people don’t get saved right away. Then, you know, maybe it’s, maybe we’re not doing what we’re supposed to be doing. And that’s not the, that’s really not the focus. Right.

[MCG]

You know, it’s amazing that, well, not only amazing, but I’m also glad that the Lord never commanded us to go and save anybody. And I think it’s very short-sighted when churches or Christians, use numbers as a means to obey. I’m the coordinator of the soul within ministry at my church. And many times you’ll hear, well, it’s not effective. And well, I haven’t seen anyone got saved. Well, you know what? That’s not your job. Your job is just to be obedient. And that’s the most important thing. And if you’re not being obedient, the numbers doesn’t matter, you know? Yeah.

[Zach]

Yeah.

[MCG]

I firmly believe that when someone plant or if you plant and someone has watered, that I will trust God for the increase.

[Sarah]

Yeah. Yes. I think just to piggyback off that thought, I think that’s so important because like you don’t know, you know, you may sow the seed and then someone 20 years down the road may bring that back up and that person may get saved and win several souls so Lord. But it’s like, just because that’s not in your number, that doesn’t mean anything. And like you said, the Lord calls us to be obedient and the Lord calls us to be faithful. And maybe he just wants to test our faithfulness. in our faith. And, that’s why he wants us to sow one, not necessarily to grow in numbers so that souls will be saved, which though I know that is his goal, but, individually, he may just be wanting to test to see if we’re faithful and obedient. So.

[MCG]

Amen. Yeah, definitely. Just to go back to something you said, Zach, because, you know, And I don’t mean this negatively because it’s just my observation, because I was born and raised in the Caribbean. And then I came to the US for college and end up in state. And I’ve been part of my church now for like 15 years. But every missionary that come through the doors of our church, we support. So I figure that’s the norm everywhere they go. If they go to a church, they get support. It wasn’t until I started doing this and having friends who are missionaries realize that they will go to churches after churches and they will preach and everything and they will get support. And I’m like, what? So we do pray that you guys will get to 100% support and more churches will pick you guys up as you go forward. But we do understand how, well, I don’t know if I understand it, but I do have an there, I guess, to some degree, how rough it is to go into church to church and not being supported. And of course, that’s not the ultimate goal, but they’re going to be bills that has to be paid.

[Sarah]

Exactly. I was going to say, our home church is similar to your all’s church, where pretty much if you come through, unless you’re not preaching the right doctrine or unless you’re way off on the Bible or something, they’re going to support you. And so that’s what we grew up as well. And then now our eyes have been open, oh, so open on things. But we do appreciate, when Zach calls and a pastor will tell us, we don’t have the finances to support you right now. So we just want to let you know that up front. But if you’d like to come and usually Zach will always say, yeah, we’ll come. You know, I feel like you have to be sensitive to the Holy Spirit in that case, too, because you might not get support, but the Lord may have you there for a specific purpose. You know, maybe there’s a kid that you reach in the kids class or your daughter makes a really nice friend there or, you know, just any reason. But we do appreciate when churches are super upfront because Our goal is to get to American Samoa. So if they would like to partner with us, that’d be great. And if not, that’s fine. Just let us find somebody else who will.

[Jay]

Amen.

[MCG]

All right. Well, you’re listening to the Moving Virus podcast. We’re sitting down with Zach and Sarah Smith, and they’ll be going off to the American Samoa. We’ll be right back.

[Jay]

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[MCG]

All right, well, let’s go into a little bit of a fun section and find out some of you guys’ favorites. Let’s tackle you this time, Zach. What is your favorite scripture verse?

[Zach]

My favorite scripture is Jeremiah 29, 13, and ye shall seek me and find me when you search for me with your whole heart.

[MCG]

Amen.

[Zach]

It’s really spoken to me even more since we hear. known for sure that God’s called us because one of the first churches we went to, or one of the first few churches we went to was a former missionary. And Sarah even asked him, you know, maybe you have some pointers, you have some advice. And the first thing he said is, if you’re ever going to make it and continue, you’re going to have to have a close relationship with God. So I know you got a lot of stuff to do as a missionary. You got a lot of things to figure out, but you, you really need to make sure relationship with God is what it’s supposed to be. And I haven’t forgot that. Neither one of us have forgot that. We tried to keep keep that that way. And when you want to be close to God, he’s never left. And so the closer you get, how that relationship’s just going to grow. So that means a lot to me.

[MCG]

Amen. Sarah.

[Sarah]

My favorite verse is Isaiah 55, 8, For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord. And I claimed that verse years ago, long before I was a missionary, and it’s so true in the day-to-day life. Definitely don’t know what we’re doing. Thank the Lord.

[Jay]

You don’t know what you’re doing, but he does and he has it all mapped out. Praise the Lord for that. All right, Sarah, let’s start with you with your favorite Bible history. What we mean by that is your favorite historical biblical account. And we tell our boys and we tell pretty much everyone that we interview. We don’t like to call them Bible stories because there’s this idea that it’s a story and it’s mythology and it’s not true, but we know everything in the word of God is true. So what’s your favorite historical biblical account?

[Sarah]

I would say my favorite story, and I feel like it’s a hard one to pick, would be Daniel and the Lion’s Den.

[Jay]

All right.

[Sarah]

And basically more so than just that story, but the story of Daniel and the life of Daniel, just in general, and how faithful he was, no matter what came through, no matter what came to him, he was there to serve the Lord, and that’s all he cared about.

[Jay]

Amen. What about you, Zach?

[Zach]

Mine is the life of Joseph. There’s just so much in the life of Joseph. Obviously, when you first think about it, you just think about how much he went through and how much he had to endure. But just knowing all those things, and he ended up where God wanted him the whole time, and then he was able to do what needed to be done. I mean, it’s just a great, obviously a testament of just being faithful and being obedient and then seeing what God can do with just somebody that’s willing to do that. And so obviously you have so many things. His brothers come back, he’s able to forgive them. It kind of teaches you too, you know, the importance of being able to do those things no matter what happens to you. And so it’s kind of hard in a life like I’ve had, which is pretty easy. to not try to keep those same things because I didn’t have my brother throw me in a bit. I didn’t get put in prison wrongfully, all those things. So it kind of makes it hard to complain about the things you’ve went through when you remember, all those things were for a purpose and ultimately he ended up where he was supposed to anyway.

[Jay]

Amen. And isn’t that kind of the way the world is leaning right now where you want to lean into your victimhood and hold that as a card and really work it for all it’s worth. But the example we have in scripture of Joseph is the absolute opposite of Yeah. Yeah. Praise the Lord for that.

[MCG]

Amen. All right. What is the most convicting scripture passage to you?

[Zach]

Yeah, I’ll go first. Romans five eight. I put that as soon as I saw that question. But God committed his love toward us in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Super easy for us to treat someone good when they’re doing something right. But to think that God loved me even while I was sinning and while I continually make maybe the wrong decisions in my life, but to know that he loved me, it’s tough to think about that because that’s how we should be too. But to know that God gave us that example and still loved us through that, man, pretty convicting.

[Jay]

Amen.

[Sarah]

I have two. I have Psalm 53, Psalm 53, where David is crying out to the Lord and just saying, you know, search me, oh Lord, things like that. And that, to me, the whole passage is convicting because I feel like as a Christian, we should be doing that daily. Like, search me. Don’t worry about anybody else. Don’t worry about my husband. Don’t worry about my kids, but Lord, change me and start in my heart. So that’s always been like, anytime I hear sermons or anytime it’s read, like, like sinks in even deeper and deeper. And then a verse for me that I actually had down was Hebrews 11:6, Without faith, it is impossible to please him. And I think when we take that literally, like no faith, not pleasing to the Lord. Like it’s just, you know, and I think when I think of it so simple like that, if I’m not willing to trust in the Lord and have faith, then I am not pleasing to the Lord. And to me, that’s just like a convicting passage.

[MCG]

That’s amazing you did it that way because I studied software engineering and within the class we had to do a bunch of logic, like topics and computations and discrete math and all these things where they kind of teach you logic. A lot of times when I look at scripture, I always convert it into the logic of like I’m writing a program or something. Kind of weird, but similar to what you just did, you know, you know, when the Bible says, resist the devil and he’ll flee from you. Well, if he’s not fleeing, you know, logically, then you’re not resisting. Exactly. That’s amazing.

[Sarah]

Wow, thank you for calling me smart. He’s calling it like he sees it. I’m definitely not likened to anybody smart.

[Jay]

All right, let’s go with you, Zach. What is the most comforting scripture, in your opinion, for you?

[Zach]

5-6, Trust in the Lord with all thine heart, lean not unto thine own understanding in all thy ways, acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths. A little bit of it is because it was my dad’s life first. And just knowing that if we acknowledge that God is the Lord of our life directing us, then it’s easier to go through the things. One, because it’s his path, and also he’s there with you. And so I think it’s just comforting to know, obviously, you don’t know what’s going to happen in this life, but once you know Jesus as your Savior, it doesn’t matter what happens because he’s there with me. Doesn’t mean it’s not difficult. At 35 years old, I try not to act like I have it all figured out because I haven’t went through what some people have been through, but I’m thankful that whatever I have to go through, I have God there with me.

[Jay]

What about you, sir?

[Sarah]

Mine would be, it says in Psalms 56:3, says, What time I am afraid, I will trust in me. And kind of, I keep it simple because you’re scared, trust in the Lord. I always tell my kids, you’re worried about getting sick, trust in the Lord. worried about the darkness, trust in the Lord, what time I’m afraid. And I think for me, that really came into full circle when my dad suffered like a major stroke and he’s in heaven now, but he died a few months after that. And we always used to quote to him, what time I’m afraid I would trust in thee. And after he got out of… having that stroke, I helped take care of him some. And he would, have some brain damage from the stroke. And I would just tell him, dad, what’s the verse we always cling to? And he would help me quote it and the kids made a sign and put it in his room. So it’s funny how the Lord orchestrates things because that was a verse I clung to long before I needed it. And the Lord instilled it in me.

[MCG]

Amen. All right. What is your favorite hymn of the faith? And be careful which one you choose because we might just ask you to sing it.

[Zach]

I would say for me, it’s victory in Jesus. Obviously, we know our victory’s in Jesus. Our singles pastor actually would sing it in a certain way. When you’re doing the chorus, there’s some refrains to it. So it’s always really memorable for me. That’s how I sing it, no matter where I am. I try to remember if I’m in a church that maybe wouldn’t sing it like that, then I don’t do the refrains, but it is one of my favorites, for sure.

[Jay]

Amen. Sarah.

[Sarah]

One of my favorites is probably When Heaven Came Down and Glory Filled My Soul.

[Jay]

Love that one.

[Sarah]

Don’t know why. It’s just always been a favorite.

[Jay]

All right. Who is your favorite giant of the faith in the scriptures?

[Zach]

So I was going to say Daniel and then Sarah stole that one. I think I’ll stick with it. I mean, to think of somebody that lived the right way, the way they were supposed to, and then faced, I mean, literally kind of like you talked about where you just break it down. Someone told him, if you pray again, You’re going to go to jail and you’re going to get put in the lion’s den. And the next day, he prayed again because that’s what he was supposed to do. That’s what he was used to doing. He was obedient and faithful. And God did something after that and ended up saving him because he was faithful. He was obedient. And to just know that he had that kind of faith, I mean, when you’re literally faced with giants and you do what God has asked you to do, it’s convicting, but it’s also encouraging that, you know, we can do it too. Just be faithful. So I would say him for sure.

[Sarah]

I would say mine is probably David. Shepherd boy David and King David, you know, all the roles he fulfilled throughout the Bible. And just to think that I always refresh myself and people, like, if God can use David, he can use anybody. Like David was a murderer and, you know, He was all these things, but he was also a man after God’s own heart. And so when you think about the life of David, I feel like it’s just amazing.

[Jay]

Amen.

[MCG]

Amen. You know, going back into that, both of you mentioned Daniel. You know, a lot of times when we talk about the book of Daniel, we talk about prophecy and all that stuff. But think about Daniel and the lion’s dead and even Shedrach, Meshach, and then Bednego. Those guys exhibit a level of faith that I wonder, you know, because you’re talking about Shodet, hungry lions.

[Jay]

Fiery furnace. Yep.

[MCG]

And they stood and I’m like, would I stand? Would I have stand being the only tree that remains standing and stuff like that? I don’t know if you guys have your kids watch this show, but some people might not like it, but it’s called Superbook.

[Sarah]

Yeah. Yes, we do. We watch it all the time. Yep.

[MCG]

It’s on YouTube. My boys love it. And sometimes I watch it with them. I just amazing seeing it in action and just knowing, man, it’s like, I wonder where is our fate at times? Because I’m like, would I stumble? Because I know there hungry lions are there or the fire furnace is there, We.

[Sarah]

Were just watching one the other day. That’s funny you said that because Zach just was mentioning that to me. It was about the Tower of Babel. And he was like, it’s just so interesting to see it like broken down like in through kids, you know, even though it’s a story of the Bible, but it’s broken down through visuals. And you’re really understanding it. And you’re like, wow, that actually like that is the Bible story and how God just did that. Yeah, it’s really cool.

[Jay]

Yeah, absolutely. So let me direct this question to Sarah and then Zach, maybe you could jump in afterwards. What are some of the biggest barriers to the people of American Samoa when it comes to receiving the gospel? We talked about how there are a lot of different religions there, a lot of different expressions, if you could say, of the Christian faith there. So you have a lot of religiosity there. But we didn’t really talk about the barriers. You mentioned for a little bit that, you know, since family is huge there, it could be a great thing or it could be a terrible thing depending on how that falls, are there any other barriers to the people of American Samoa receiving the gospel?

[Sarah]

I would say those are probably definitely the two huge barriers.

[Jay]

Okay.

[Sarah]

And I would say maybe the only other barrier would be, you know, the people I’ve experienced from American Samoa have been very warm and welcoming and loving. But is that more because I had a connection through their family members already? And so I would say the other barrier would be like that were the American missionaries trying to bring a new philosophy, if you will, to them. So I would say that might be another barrier because we’re kind of outsiders in that sense.

[Jay]

Gotcha.

[Sarah]

But I would say definitely, I couldn’t really think of any other huge barriers to it besides the family and possibly the different religions, unless you can think of someone.

[Zach]

I would just piggyback on that, that we have been told by some other people that they can have a tendency in that culture to kind of tell you what you want to hear. And so maybe not as genuine as you would really want for someone when you’re trying to share the gospel with them. You want them to know obviously that they’re lost so that they can be saved, but also you want to know that they believe or what you’re telling them instead of just saying that they believe it. And so I think that would be really one of the biggest barriers is are they going to be genuine enough for you to really get to know them and then to kind of break down those walls to where they are actually willing to say, okay, what I believed in forever, I see you’re saying, and I believe it’s not the right way to heaven, and I want this Jesus that you’re telling me about. So I think that’s really knowing that they’re genuine in their relationships, and I guess it would be the interactions you have with them.

[MCG]

And how can those barriers be removed?

[Zach]

I think the first way to remove those barriers is to let them know that you’re not there for them to, you know, agree with everything you say. I want those people to be my friends. I really do. And I think God’s given us a love, like Sarah said, for them before we got there so that when we get there, we can be genuine. I’m going there because I love them and I want them to know how to be saved. And it’s so simple, But it’s also something that I’ve known my whole life, so it’s simpler to me than it would be to other people. And so I think removing those barriers would be letting them know that I’m genuine in my love for them and the fact that I love them because Christ loved me and he loves them too, giving them the opportunity to know that it’s not by anything you do, but by you accepting the free gift of salvation that now you get to go to heaven. I think those barriers will then be able to be removed because they understand there’s nothing I have to check this box for. I just have to accept this gift that’s right in front of me. And while that can seem simple, it also can get really complicated when you talk about family members having a role in that and them stopping you from telling them the right way or them being so dependent on their family and the religion that they’re trusting in, that they’re not willing to really understand that that might be false and that there is actually a way to get to heaven.

[Sarah]

Years ago, we cut out this thing in our bulletin at our home church long before we were missionaries and put it on our fridge. And it’s in our missionary video, but it says a missionary. And the definition of it is someone who leaves their family for a little while so that others can spend with theirs in eternity. And I think that has been like a major focus of ours and just letting them know that like there is an eternity that you will spend. And there’s one of two places and that’s heaven or hell. And the Bible is so clear about that. And there is a way, God made a way for heaven, and he was willing to give his only son to do that. And if you’re a mom, I feel like just thank, or dad, just when you’re a parent, thinking about someone giving their son for a world who rejects them. It blows me away when I still think about it to this day. And so because of that, though, they have the chance to spend forever with their family members. And so I think going about it that way and not using their family in a way, but like using their family as a motivation, if that makes sense, and just preaching the gospel through that way and saying, there’s a place you can go forever and it’s free. It’s free to anyone, no matter who you are, where you’re from, what color you are, how much you make, and the simplest thing you can do, just like a childlike faith is call upon him and trust in Jesus and put your faith and trust in him and him alone. And I think we minimize the use of the Holy Spirit in this way sometimes. And I do it in my daily life, and I’m sure all of us Christians sometimes do it, but really pray that the Holy Spirit will prick on hearts. And we’re already praying that God is going to prick on the Samoan people’s hearts, and he’s going to soften their hearts to the gospel. And using the Spirit of the Lord before us, we know God always goes before us, and really taking advantage of that in a way, not in a bad way, but using that for the cause of Christ and just preaching the word. how many things I think about X, Y, and Z, but it’s like the Bible is the only word that is true through all times. And so just preaching the word and using that, I feel like it’s going to help break down that barrier.

[MCG]

With that, Sarah, it was indeed a pleasure. Thank you for joining us on the Removing Barriers podcast.

[Sarah]

Thank you so much for having us. I wish we were in person. I feel like we could get real chatty here. Thank you so much. And we’ll try to stay in contact with us. That’ll be great.

[Jay]

Absolutely.

[Sarah]

We really enjoyed it.

[MCG]

Yeah, definitely.

[Jay]

Thank you so much for listening to the Removing Barriers podcast. Make sure to rate us everywhere you listen to podcasts, including Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, or Stitcher. Removing Barriers, a clear view of the cross.

[MCG]

Thank you for listening. To get a hold of us, to support this podcast, or to learn more about removing barriers, go to removingbarriers.net. This has been the Removing Barriers podcast. We attempted to remove barriers so that we all can have a clear view of the cross.