Episode 180

The United States is only a few days away from what is already one of the most consequential and riveting presidential elections in recent history. On November 5th, the American people will vote to make their will known. While some Christians do not participate in the democratic process, there are many who will. How should the Christian consider Trump in this election, with his legal woes, polarizing reputation, and vitriolic opposition? Should it matter to Christians that he is a convicted felon? In this episode of the Removing Barriers podcast, we will discuss these questions and how some Christians may be weighing them before heading to the polls.

[Jay]

What exactly are those quote unlawful memes were in this case up to the jury to decide. Prosecutors put forth 3 areas that they could consider a violation of campaign finance laws, falsification of other business records, or a violation of tax laws.

Thank you for tuning in to the Removing Barriers podcast. I’m Jay and MCG. And we’re attempting to remove barriers so we can all have a clear view of the cross.

[MCG]

This is episode 180 of the Removing Barriers podcasts, and in this episode, we will be discussing former President Donald Trump and the Christian vote.

[Jay]

Hi, this is Jay. MCG and I would like for you to help us remove barriers by going to removingbarriers.net and subscribing to receive all things, removing barriers. If you’d like to take your efforts a bit further and help us keep the mics on, consider donating at removingbarriers.net/donate. Removing Barriers, a clear view of the cross.

[MCG]

All right, Jay. Donald Trump and the Christian vote, so we know back in July he was actually convicted of what, 34 felonies. Do you believe he actually did what he was convicted of?

[Jay]

I can see how people on both sides could make the argument that he was certainly guilty and actually did those things that he was convicted of. But what makes this so difficult to piece apart? And to get to the truth down to the truth of is the fact that it’s all. Happening during an election year, much of it appears to be politically motivated, and there have been repeated instances of assassination attempts on Trump’s life that I think in many ways further complicates the issue. Because heated rhetoric. Might incite people to do things that they otherwise wouldn’t do. Lady Liberty, as they say, is supposed to be blind. Justice is supposed to be blind, but in this particular case it isn’t, and in many ways there are fingers from both sides on the scales, and it makes it really difficult. To accurately determine what did he do and what didn’t he do and what the results or the effect would be down the road or here to. Today, what do you think?

[MCG]

Yeah, I think before we even talk about what we believe the charges he actually did, what he was convicted of, agree or disagree. The first question I have in my mind is, do we even understand what he was convicted of? That’s a deeper question for me. So we.

[Jay]

Yeah.

[MCG]

Travel CBS News article about his charges and he explain it and I’m going to have you read it. But you know, I am a fan of watching. In court cases on YouTube, a lot of times, if he’s a famous court case like Ahmad Arberry or even Derek Shovin, not Amar Berry, the Mcmichaels when they were being child for about a mother very. Right for that.

[Jay]

A.

[MCG]

Case case. Derek Chauvin when he was going to the court system for. Joy flown and others. I’ll have them just playing in the. Background and listening to them, lawyers, arguments and back and forth. Illegal stuff. I’m intrigued by those kind of things. And so I’m no lawyer, but I figure if there’s a charge out there or something like that, yeah. At least have a good understanding of the law. The person break and what exactly they’ve been convicted of.

[Jay]

MHM.

[MCG]

I almost feel like you need to. Be. A lawyer to understand what he was charged with and I don’t think it should be that way, right? But anyway, I’ll just let you read the article. Then we will discuss after the.

[Jay]

To. OK, former President Donald Trump’s conviction in New York stemmed from a $130,000 hush money payment his attorney, Michael Cohen, made to an adult film star named Stormy Daniels in the days before the 2016 election. So if I could just insert this alleged encounter with Stormy Daniels happened nearly 20 years ago, but. Right before the election, the accusation was that he paid her money to be quiet about the affair. It was done in. Let’s. Just say it. The accusation is that it was done in a less than legal way through his attorney, Michael Cohen, and now we’re going to.

[MCG]

Well, I would necessarily have done less than legal way to me. You know, of course, when you’re running for political office in the United States, especially your past, normally somehow come out of their words, think of justice Kavanaugh when he was.

[Jay]

MHM.

[MCG]

Nominated by Trump and going through the Senate, all of a sudden, people from 20-30 years ago come forward and say ohh well, he shouldn’t be a Supreme Court Justice because he raped me 100 years ago or so. Whatever case may be exaggerating, of course. But that’s the political game that is normally go through. So basically they’re saying hey.

[Jay]

Yeah, you’re right.

[MCG]

Stormy Daniels was, for lack of a better term, a woman of the night. He paid her, and again, all these are alleged to have no idea if these are true or not. I will share my opinion a bit later on that, but allegedly he paid her for even. Then and allegedly this was when his wife Melania Trump, was pregnant with their youngest son, Baron John.

[Jay]

Sharon.

[MCG]

So now he’s running for office. He doesn’t want her to come out of the woodworks and start saying, hey, all these dirty things about him. Hey, I was with this man, so his lawyer paid her $130,000 and Trump is going to repay his lawyer. Other means.

[Jay]

Right. The article continues and it says that prosecutors said that the deal was meant to keep voters in the dark about Daniel’s allegation that she had a physical, intimate encounter with Trump years earlier, which he denies. But the actual charges that Trump faced were far less salacious. This is directly quoting from the CBS article. The charges that he faced were far less salacious and dealt with the comparatively mundane paperwork that was generated when he reimbursed Cohen for the payment. Here’s what you need to know about the charges that he face. What was he convicted of? He was charged with 34 counts of falsification of business records in the first degree, which is a felony in New York. He pleaded not guilty when he was arraigned last year.

[MCG]

So in order for him to be convicted of falsifying documents, firstly, at least in my mind, and again, I’m no lawyer in my mind, it has to be proven somehow that he had that physical relationship with her, and then he did had his lawyer. Pay her the hush money. To me that is not proven. If you go to charge someone for something and the crime that he did is sandwiched between two different actions and the first action is not proven, how do you prove that middle action or that middle charge that you’re charging?

[Jay]

With OK and 2017. Colin and Island Weisselberg, an executive at the Trump Organization, reached an agreement about how Cohen would be repaid for the $130,000 that he sent to Daniels in exchange for her silence. Weisselberg detailed the calculations and handwritten notes that were shown to the jury at trial. Dale Cohen would receive $130,000 for the Daniels payment, plus $50,000 intended for a technology company that did unrelated work for Trump. That amount was doubled to account for taxes that Cohen would have to pay on the income weisselberg then tackled on an extra $60,000 as a bonus for Cohen. Who was upset that his regular year end award had been cut? The total worked out to be $420,000. Cohen would be paid in a series of monthly payments of $35,000 over the course of 2017. The first check was for $70,000, covering two months, Cohen sent an invoice to the Trump Organization for each check, portraying the payment as his quote retainer every time he was paid a bookkeeper. Generated a record of the company’s files, known as a voucher, with the description, quote legal expense. The first 3 payments were made from Trump’s trust, while the remaining nine came from his personal account. Don’t.

[MCG]

So it is that line that was recorded, so he paid Cohen and they say his legal services, when he was actually a repayment for Stormy Daniels.

[Jay]

And this is a felony in New York, they say.

[MCG]

Because he’s falsifying business records and not only fortifying business record. This is according to them, he’s not only for the flying busing record, he’s doing it to hide A crime. That’s what making the felony. And doing it to hide A crime makes it a felony. But then as we read along a bit further, they didn’t specify exactly right what that crime was.

[Jay]

OK. Talk to me like I’m four years old. Was the crime in meeting with the woman of the night, or was the crime in paying Michael Cohen back?

[MCG]

The crime was for the fine entries in his business document. To hide the fact that he was paying back Stormy Daniels.

[Jay]

Right. He was doing that in support of a crime.

[MCG]

Right on the line.

[Jay]

Crime. Wasn’t this the legal case where the judge told the jury that it didn’t matter which crime you chose? OK. OK, right. OK, let me just continue reading. Maybe it’ll clear up in my head here. Each of the 34.

[MCG]

We’ll continue reading with, I think we’ll, I’m going to.

[Jay]

Charges against Trump corresponded to a check invoice and voucher generated to reimburse Cohen. The prosecution laid out the charges in a chart that jurors saw several times during the trial. Prosecutors said that Trump knew the payments were to reimburse Cohen for the Daniels payment, not for his legal expenses. The jury voted to convict on all 34 counts as Trump looked on. The courts. Clerk asked the four person of the jury for the verdict. How say you the first count of in the indictment charging Donald J Trump? With the crime of falsifying business records in the first degree, guilty or not guilty, the clerk asked guilty. The four person responded, repeating the answer 33 more times. So why were the charges of felony under New York law falsification of business records is a crime when the records are altered with an intent to defraud, to be charged as a felony, prosecutors must also show that the offender intended to commit another crime or aid or conceal another crime when falsifying records in Trump’s case. Prosecutors said that other crime was a violation of a New York election law that makes it illegal for any two or more persons to conspire to promote or prevent the election of any person to a public office by unlawful means as justice. Marshawn flamed in his instructions to the jury. What exactly are those quote unlawful means were in this case up to the jury to decide? Prosecutors put forth 3 areas that they could consider a violation of campaign finance laws, falsification of other business records, or a violation of tax laws.

[MCG]

And there it goes again. I’m no lawyer, but I’ve never seen a case where it is up to the jury to determine what the crime, what the online crime is.

[Jay]

To. Right.

[MCG]

It’s usually OK let me put it this way because again, I’m no lawyer, so. Let’s take the George Zimmerman case, for instance. My. I know in some cases you can say, OK, we’re gonna charge you for murder, and then we gonna charge you for lesser offenses as well. So I remember in the judgement case it was OK. I think it was second degree murder, first degree murder. Then they wanted to also having charge for second degree murder. Or at least the Jew with the country, the second degree murder. And also to consider child abuse or something. That. But you can understand that you know in many cases, OK, this is the main crime. They they they committed, let’s say rape. Let’s say someone serves to go so dark. But let’s say someone breaking the woman home and physically assault her, you know, that’s the main charge, but they can charge for breaking and entering and forcible whatever case may be. And now all the lesser. Charges these were not like the charges. They were saying that hey. We believe you had an affair with this woman, which is not a crime. Paying her to hush her mouth is not a crime. Time. But because you paid her to her her mouth so that you can.

[Jay]

Run for office.

[MCG]

When an election or somehow default the electoral process.

[Jay]

Right.

[MCG]

Then that make it a crime, which I can see why that would be a crime. But again, they’re not saying that’s the crime. They’re saying jury. You tell us what the crime is and I’m like, shouldn’t the prosecution prove?

[Jay]

MHM.

[MCG]

The crime, should the prosecution prove it, or the shade of doubt that he slept with Stormy Daniels and prove he proved, or the shadow of a doubt that he paid Cohen to shut her.

[Jay]

MHM.

[Jay]

And then subsequently.

[MCG]

Up. Mm-hmm. And it’s because he was trying to defraud the New York system or whatever case. May be to. Me. Without this article, I don’t even know if I would understand what. I don’t even know if I understand, but somewhat understand what they’re saying. He’s charged with so anyways, so shall continue.

[Jay]

I think it’s very interesting that this judge, his last name, is synonymous in my language for evil Misha. OK, here we go. The jurors did not need to agree. Like you just said MCD. The jurors did not need to agree on what the. Underlying unlawful means were, but they did have to unanimously conclude, what am I? Meeting the jurors did not need to agree on what the underlying unlawful means were, but they did have to unanimously conclude that Trump caused the business records to be falsified and that he did so with the intent to defraud. That included an intent to commit another crime or to aid or conceal the Commission thereof. This is it, me, or is this is unprecedented. I can’t recall a case. Again, I’m no lawyer. I can’t even play one. On TV, I can’t remember a case where these stipulations were in place.

[MCG]

To me is get him at any cost.

[Jay]

Yeah, that’s what it looks like to me.

[MCG]

Like we’re going to get you and something’s going to stick. We’re gonna fling as much stuff at the wall and something’s gonna stick.

[Jay]

And we’ll run with whatever sticks. OK. OK. So, what was Trump’s defense? The article continues. Trump’s lawyers argued that the payments to Cohen were for his work as Trump’s attorney, not reimbursements for the Daniels payment. The defense argued that the descriptions on the invoices and the records were. Accurate Cohen held the title quote personal attorney to the president once Trump took office and was being paid for his legal services under an unwritten retainer agreement. Therefore, their argument went no business records were falsified. They also focused much of their firepower on patrolling Cohen as a liar, with the goal of discrediting his testimony. Cohen was the only witness who testified that Trump knew about the true purpose of the reimbursements, a crucial pillar of the prosecutors efforts to show Trump’s info. Ultimately, the jurors rejected the defense’s arguments and sided with prosecutors in finding Trump guilty.

[MCG]

I think we can leave it there. They talk about when it can be sentenced and stuff like that.

[Jay]

Which I don’t think he can be sentenced into laughter. It seems they postponed everything after the the election.

[MCG]

I think they push it until. After election now this episode is coming out just shortly before the election. So.

[Jay]

Before then. And again, completely unprecedented. What’s happening here in terms of what happens next? OK. And I guess suppose we’ll leave that there, but.

[MCG]

Yeah. So from the article. OK, so the first thing, do we even understand what he was convicted of? Well, somewhat, I guess. Right. And that is coming from CBS News deliberately. We chose that one because they’re no friend of Trump, sure, and still, can we say even their explanation is bonkers. You know, if this was Fox News or something trying to be nice to Trump, I would say, OK, maybe, but this is serious news. Can we say that? You know, somewhat his bonkers. It’s not clear exactly what it is, because we don’t know what the underlying crime was, and we don’t even know if he actually slept with Daniels. None of that were proven. So should he have been charged for the online issue first? I don’t know. That’s the one guessing game to me. Let’s say everything with Daniels and whatever is true and the payment. What is the statue of limitation on that you know? And if the other nine crime is a federal crime, what does this have to do with New York State? Those are things are going to my mind when it comes to, you know, do I believe he actually did what he was convicted of?

[Jay]

MHM.

[MCG]

Of course, if everything he did, which Tommy Daniel is true, he committed fortification, which is sinful. Mm-hmm. However, not a crime. Was it even proven that the payment was for silent, stormy Daniel and legal fields to Cohen, Cohen actually went to jail for other stuff. So Cohen himself is, I think he’s a felon right at this point, you know, so on the surface, if the fornication with Tommy then is true, Trump has denied this. If it is true and personally, to be honest. I believe it’s true. Sure, it’s repayment thing is. True, and I wouldn’t put him past him.

[Jay]

MHM.

[MCG]

I don’t think Trump is no saying I’m not gonna put the cross him. It’s still not a crime. All that is not a crime. The 1st. 2. Stuff Funimation, right? Paying her to hush him out? Not a crime. Still, what is the underlying stuff? Did you prove it that he actually did it to win the elections? I don’t know. It’s almost anyone guessing game, but if the standing.

[Jay]

MHM.

[MCG]

If we don’t reasonable doubt, I have reasonable doubt.

[Jay]

Let me ask this, and I’m probably going to sound like an idiot for asking this, but what underlying crime did the jury decide?

[MCG]

According to the article from CBS, uh-huh, they did not have to agree on the honor and crime so they could choose choose one of three well, as long as they agree that he did one of the three, they come back with guilty.

[Jay]

They could. Right. So they didn’t have to pick a specific one, they could just say, hey, he did one of those three and and they didn’t even have to specify which one of three.

[MCG]

So right so. No, they didn’t have to agree which one it is. They just have to agree that he did a crime.

[Jay]

Which wasn’t proven at least. OK, forgive me because I have a public school education, but it seems to me that when you go through the legal system criminal, this was criminal you. To determine if the person is guilty of that particular crime.

[MCG]

Yeah, but the crime he was technically guilty of was falsifying. The records. That’s the crime. He was guilty of.

[Jay]

But I understand.

[MCG]

But he was guilty of that because of three underlying crimes that wasn’t proven.

[Jay]

So then it can’t be a crime because the law says that it has to be in support of or with the intent to, you know, do or or whatever another crime.

[MCG]

I agree. I agree. I agree, and again, I’m no lawyer, so I might not even be explaining it properly, but I’m just explaining it the way I understand it.

[Jay]

It just seems to me like you said they’re out to get them. It seems like a witch hunt like get them at all costs like you mean.

[MCG]

Yeah, I do think he’s a political Richard Alvin Bragg, which is the Manhattan DA’s campaign on getting him prosecuting Trump. Right. And to me, the fact that Hillary Clinton was a persecuted for her server in the bathroom and emailed debacle. The fact that Joe Biden was deemed too old and grandfatherly for child on the classified documents.

[Jay]

MHM.

[MCG]

But Trump is not the fact that Mike Pence was also found in classified documents in his position, but he was not. Guide the arm of justice does not seem blind.

[Jay]

Hmm.

[MCG]

And it does not seem even.

[Jay]

And it seems right.

[MCG]

That’s why I’m calling the political witch one.

[Jay]

The witch hunt for sure.

[MCG]

Because. Look, I remember when what? His name? The former FBI director that went and did the press conference in this was October 2016, about two weeks before the election. And he went and say Hillary Clinton did death, but no one has ever been convicted under this.

[Jay]

Mm-hmm.

[MCG]

Crime. So we not going to be prosecuting her. I remember when he did that. I remember his name right now off the top of my head.

[Jay]

I’ll pull it up. His name is unzipping my turn to.

[MCG]

But. But I remember I was talking to. Lawyer who had been trying federal crimes James comedy for he said at that .30 years or something like that, when I asked him this question, I didn’t even know he was a lawyer. This was a total stranger. Mm-hmm. I kind of strike up conversation with and because that was the news of the day, I kind of brought it up and he got upset because he said.

[Jay]

James comedy.

[MCG]

Hey, I’ve been a lawyer for this amount of time and I’ve never seen anything like that. So Hillary Clinton walk.

[Jay]

Mm-hmm.

[MCG]

Joe Biden walk Mike Pence walk and everybody else that did something that was but Trump to me, as they say, what’s good for the geese is good for the.

[Jay]

Goose for the good, good for the gooses, good for the gander.

[MCG]

But we’re good. We’re good. Good for the gander. So to me, it’s political return and I guess you can take it a bit further. Is it election interference?

[Jay]

Yeah, I would say that it is, they know. That the prosecution of all these different cases. Oh, let’s leave the other cases alone for now. Of this particular case with the intensity and with the fervency that they are doing, it will hamper him from campaigning doing all that he can in order to do what candidates do when they’re campaigning for the high office of President. And so it’s funny because. Everything that they accuse Trump of doing or that he will be doing if he gets back into office, they are doing right now, they are interfering and they are the ones weaponizing all of these different justice entities in order to bring about a result that they want. You’ve talked about how all of these different political. Personalities. These people who did in many ways the same thing that he did and were never charged for it or never pursued legally the way that they’re pursuing him now. For goodness sake, President Barack Obama personally ordered the drone strike killing Abdul Rahman al Laki. Who was the son of a Terra? Christ, just so that he could send a message to the terrorist organization and there’s been no pursuit. There’s been no digging up or opening of what I would consider to be a crime.

[MCG]

Well, in Obama’s defense, the Supreme Court did say that presidents can’t be tried for official acts as president. So which?

[Jay]

Well, that’s another thing that comes up with Trump because there’s this question about the immunity that President has, the Supreme Court just right. And so anyway, let’s go back. I’m going in in a million directions here. This is completely election interference.

[MCG]

That the Supreme Court just confirmed.

[Jay]

I don’t think you can describe it as anything else.

[MCG]

I will agree. I again. If we gonna this political which and we also have to conclude this election interference but you know.

[Jay]

Sure.

[MCG]

But again, he’s not on the Democratic ticket, right? If he was on the Democratic ticket, it would be a big different thing because the major news organization would be on his side and would would see it this way.

[Jay]

We might not even have heard about any of this if this if you were on the democratic ticket.

[MCG]

Yeah. So. So this is how I see it. The Major General organization, Kamala, goes to Burger King and buys burger for everyone. The major news organization. She’s a kind, sweet and caring person. Trump goes to Burger King and buy a burger for everyone. It’s McDonald’s. The major news organization saying. He’s just pandering for the votes and I.

[Jay]

Think he’s promoting unhealthy eating?

[MCG]

Yeah, but I think the vote is going to be right to rent both sides pander.

[Jay]

I really do think that. Yes. And I think that when it comes to these things, I think Americans can see that this is election interference. And I think that in some ways. We’ve seen this backfire in terrible ways for the Democratic Party. Whenever they go after Trump in these particular ways, I think that they don’t give the American people enough credit to notice or to see, or to realize that this is a warfare, not warfare. I’m sorry, what is it called when you use the lawfare? Yes, thank you. Law.

[MCG]

Low fare.

[Jay]

There the way that they did this was to dilute the power or the respect that the American justice system is supposed to have eroding. In many ways, the trust and the confidence that the American people have, that the justice system can be used, will be used in a true and legal good faith way. Your. And not in any weaponized sort of. We’re out to get you type of way. I wish I could remember which politician said this, but he essentially said that if you cross the so-called. Government. They have. What did he say? Six ways to Sunday or seven ways to Sunday to get back at you or to? Screw you over or the words. That he used and he had no compunction, no hesitation to say something like that, and it shouldn’t be that way. And yet it is. So I think that the American people are watching this take place and they’re watching the legacy media will say the ABC, NBC, CNN, MSNBC, they’re watching them run interference for the Democratic Party and for the ones that are going after Trump. And it. Our confidence in that. System less than what it was when the pandemic hit, and that’s saying a lot and you can’t really have a society where the people don’t want to engage in your system anymore when they have no confidence in it and they don’t want to participate in it. That’s a very dangerous place to be as a country.

[MCG]

Well, that maybe they aim for. If the people that are so upset and discuss about what they’re doing this and not to participate, who’s gonna participate? That’s the people that will vote for them, I guess.

[Jay]

OK. So, so now. OK. He’s been found guilty and the sentencing obviously has been postponed until after the election. And that opens up another can of worms. Because if he’s convicted and other sentencing does, he go to jail? What if he’s elected? What happens then? Does no. The reason I bring that up is because should he go to jail for a non violent crime? Was anyone killed in this crime? No.

[MCG]

Well, we’ll talk about that a little bit later.

[Jay]

As terrible as this allegedly is as it sounds, this is not a violent crime. Should he go to jail for that?

[MCG]

Well, for me the answer is yes. If you come into the family, yeah, go to jail. Because if I did it.

[Jay]

You would be in jail, right?

[MCG]

Are you going to? Whatever that I would go to prison for should be the same thing that the Hillary Clinton to Donald Trump and Obama’s of the world should. Go to prison. For right, if the strong arm of the government is going to come after me for something, they should go after them for the same reason. Hmm, you know. I think Lady Justice, as you say, should be blind and even no respect of person and that’s their unique foundation that the US justice system was found upon that no one is above the law. So if he truly did these things, and if it’s truly a felony and all these things, he should be in jail as a matter of fact, he should have already been sent. Well, I guess I have heard of all the people who have been convicted and their sentencing take a while, 1-2 years before they were actually sentenced. So I guess they’re not treating them any differently from a lot of people. But for most people, I guess with nonviolent crime, even for the violent crime in a month or so, they would have held him in jail and sentenced him already. But I guess it’s because it. A nonviolent crime they can hold off on the sentencing, but in short, for me, right, if all this is true. What is non violent or violent? If I would have gone to jail for it, President or king or whatever you are, you don’t have king in in the United States, but whatever you are, you should go to jail for the same thing too. That’s easy. Simple principle.

[Jay]

I have. Does it change your opinion of him? Because, say this about President Trump, everyone knows who he is when it comes to name recognition. He’s got that 100%. Everyone knows who he is and he’s an incredibly polarizing figure. You either love him or you hate him. Where do you fall on that spectrum? And did this conviction change your perception of him?

[MCG]

No, because. I didn’t have really high expectation of President Trump morally anyway, I already said I believe he did it. Did I think it rise to the level of 34 felonies like New York is saying? No, I don’t. Right. But, you know, I personally think Trump is funny. You know, I don’t necessarily, you know, morally. I think he’s bankrupt, of course, but.

[Jay]

He is? Yeah, he is pretty funny.

[MCG]

Otherwise, I think you know he might be of a software engineering teacher. And. You know. I never liked President Trump persona, you know, and I think a lot of people, they will say that they. Don’t. Like his persona. But I don’t vote based on Persona, and if I’m not going to vote based on moral values. Quite honestly, none of the candidates running right now where there’s Trump or Kamala to me, would pass muster. If I’m based on how I judge my values. Because I’m going to hold you against the biblical standard. Sure. And so none of them would pass again. These are all alleged. But Kamala Harris is accused of, well, at this point, I don’t even think it’s. The. Alleged going with a married man back in her early 20s, late 20s. What’s his name? Willie browner. What his name is while he was still married. And who? Surveils. She’s accused of using her female Wiles to make her way to the top. That’s no different than paying Stormy Daniels. Mm-hmm. In my book. So I’m not voting based on Persona or moral values because none of them have it, you know.

[Jay]

Yeah, I think Christians should be careful, though. I mean, I know that we all love our country and we want things to get back on track, but sometimes the way that I hear people talk about Trump, it’s almost like a deification, almost a glorification of the man. And I think that even though he’s clearly, in my opinion, let me say in my opinion, he’s clearly the better choice here. We still need to hold him up to the biblical standard and not put him on some type of impossible pedestal when he’s obviously. As morally bankrupt as anyone else that’s on the playing field, yeah.

[MCG]

So what I am glad for is that win or lose for Trump, he’s not gonna be running in 2028. He’s not going to be a candidate in 2020 and most likely, of course, Trump would have to win. Kamala Harris most likely not going to be a candidate in 2020 if Trump wins, so at least we’re going to have somewhat of a clean ticket, assuming Trump wins, he’s gone in four years.

[Jay]

Mm-hmm.

You’re optimistic.

[MCG]

I don’t think Kamala Harris can have a fierce shot to get through the Democratic primaries. I think they put the ring in there just because she’s a vice president. I don’t think her likability rate is the enough to go to the primary or win, and it can prove that in 2019 she didn’t really go that far.

[Jay]

You’re very kind and.

[MCG]

So.

[Jay]

Stick.

[MCG]

Hey, they’re Democrats kicked out the 80 plus year old candidate.

[Jay]

And installed.

[MCG]

And.

[Jay]

The DI candidate.

[MCG]

And put Kamala Harris there. So the track record for 80 plus year olds in politics at least running for president doesn’t look good. So if Trump is going to be 80 plus in 2028 when he’s running, the Republican Party would likely just do the same thing. He’s too old to be running. So I don’t think Trump is gonna run. He already said he wouldn’t run in 2028 anyway. So we’re not lose. He’s gone. He wins. Kamala is most likely gone. So you’re gonna have a fresh slate going forward. That’s what I’m glad for, because predominantly I’m tired of Trump and the Bidens and the to some degree, to come out of the world running. Can we get some younger blood and fresh ideas and stuff like that? And maybe people that at least want to stand up on biblical principle? That’s what I’m looking for.

[Jay]

OK, there’s a chance that that can happen. That’s the optimistic way to look at it. But I think that.

[MCG]

I don’t think it’s optimistic that Trump won’t be there. I can’t imagine him being 82 going to be there.

[Jay]

No, no, no, no. I’m talking about how much both he and the Democratic Party have fundamentally changed America and how we do politics and the place of politics in our lives. I don’t think going forward that it’ll ever be the same. And so in my view, I’d hate to sound like a Debbie Downer, but I think that the political process has changed so deeply. And a lot of the underlying causes remain unresolved because we’re quibbling about the surface issues and the deep issues ever get resolved. I don’t think that we’re going to see normal elections for quite some time.

[MCG]

Well. I would say if Kamala wins and things continue as it is, which most likely would be if you win, you will continue as it is, I would agree. But if Trump were in the Trump is going to pull things back a little bit in terms of I expect to see prices come down because of Jill, Baby, Jill basically. And then I expect to see the border in order little bit more control and stuff like that. And if for some reason Trump wins, he better hope that the Republicans we needed the house or the Senate or vote. But if they got vote, then he probably could get some stuff done in the first two years in the last two years, going to be lame duck. So they might not want to do anything. Most likely Chuck records should that he probably is going to lose one of them in the midterms in 2026. So he has two years to really get a lot of this stuff done. If the Republicans get control of the house and the Senate and he wins so and that part things going to change a little bit more, I guess quote UN quote for the better if you want to put it that way. But if Kamala wins and the Democrats get the house and the Senate, well, you can see a reinstallation. Of or codifying of Roe V Wade in federal laws, you can expect to see. Loosening standards at the border you can expect to see a little bit more higher taxes and stuff. Like. That. Yeah. Yeah. So I think those are the difference you’re looking at here. But anyways, you’re listening to removing barriers podcast. We are discussing Donald Trump, the former president of the United States and the Christian vote. We’ll be right back.

[Jay]

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[MCG]

Alright, Gee, so how does our relationship with Christ affect how we vote?

[Jay]

Seems to me that if we are genuinely converted and that we have submitted to Christ as Lord and Savior King, it should be foundational to how we vote. We should be voting in line with biblical principles. Seeking to select the candidate. That most closely aligns. With obedience to reverence for the principles that have been established in God’s word. So it seems to me that it’s impossible to vote for someone that would be in favor of something as atrocious as abortion. It seems to me impossible to vote for someone in favour of debauchery that we see. In one of the two parties, I won’t. I won’t mention which one. I think all of us listening know which one and so. Our relationship with Christ changes us fundamentally, and the way that we vote is affected as a result thou that may not mean that you would be voting along party lines. What they would consider to be this quote Christian. Party or even a party that is historically so-called Christian. I put quotations around that because we’re seeming to throw that word around a lot these days, but it may very well be, for example, in our country. That you vote for a Democratic candidate. If the Democratic candidate is more closely aligned to scripture than the Republican candidate is when Christ is the feather that you flock around, you do not have. Any type of loyalty or tie to a particular party. It’s about what does the Lord say in his word, and how can we effectively put people in office. That would implement policy that would bring us more closely in line with the principles that we. See in scripture.

[MCG]

Yeah, should our relationship with Christ affect how we vote? Yeah, 100% should affect our vote. You know, a lot of time. You hear folks like to say they want to separate their politics and their religion, but in truth, you cannot separate politics and religion, especially in this country. Your belief on morality, family values. Finances life are all affected by religious belief and what else affect all those things, your politics. For me, you know, and I think I’m clear every time we are on this podcast, my views are based upon the Bible. At least I try to base it purely upon the Bible that are not altered. The word of God. I will be voting for the person most closely aligned to the values I see in the word of God. I’m not going to be voting based on party. I’m not going to vote based on gender. Or race or persona, but aren’t the principles of the word of God, at least the ones that are closely aligned, and that could be that I might do a right in that might be I’m going to vote the Democrats that might be I’m going to vote the Republicans but. But. Is never going to be. The party is always going to be who is the closest based upon principles of the Word of God and also to some degree who’s closer aligned to the word of God and who’s most likely probably going to win. I’ll have the opportunity to win because I can go there and write in my pastor. But I don’t think my path is interested in the job of the President of the United States.

[Jay]

Right. So you don’t want to throw away that vote, right?

[MCG]

So at the end of the day, they’re going to be, at least in their 2024 general election, they’re going to be two major choices for President. You can never choose one which one of those are most closely aligned to the principles of the word of God. But at the same time, one of those that would be on the ticket, the leader of opposition party, is now a felon. Should we be voting for someone who is a felon?

[Jay]

Yes, the reason I say that is because we’ve allowed the justice system to change so drastic. Only one can make the argument that it really hasn’t changed. It’s only been exposed. That anyone that the government would deem a felon, even if biblically they don’t meet that, OK, erase all that. Let me just say it like this. We have made it so that we’ve allowed the justice system to determine who’s a felon, not because of the preponderance of evidence, not because they’ve been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. In a court of law, but because of the weaponization of the institutions. Whether it’s activist judges, whether it’s the weaponization of entities like the FBI or the CIA, or fill in the blank. Like so they can call you a felon, or they can find you to be a felon because they choose to. And once they slap that title felon on you, it would give normal people pause to vote for you. Because obviously, if you’re a felon, you must have done something wrong, right? But I hesitate to do this because I don’t want to draw any parallels between Trump and Christ. I’m not doing that at all at all. Anyone that knows me would know that in many instances, I’m critical of Trump. But when our Lord and Savior walked the earth according to the established religious and legal and. And whoever is the ruling class of that particular day, he was found to be a so-called felon and sentenced to die. He was on the wrong side of human law, as it were, and they labeled him to be something that he obviously wasn’t. Now, again, I’m not drawing a parallel between Trump and Christ. I’m not saying that Trump is not guilty. I’m not saying any of those things I’m saying in the type of government and judicial system that we have now, anyone can be labeled. Felon even if they don’t deserve it.

[MCG]

Yeah. Should we be voting for him since he’s now a felon? Well, for this felony that we need a law degree to understand, I will say yes. Yeah, because I can understand the law is written in such a way that regular folks may not be able to read it and understand it because it’s written in legalese and not in regular English. Mm-hmm. But I believe once he goes through the court. System, which is what the court system is for and especially our form of justice, where you have the lawyers arguing out, but then you have juries which are regular people. The founders put it out with regular. People, I think once you go to the court system, regular people should be able to understand or explain it. And that’s the problem here. Regular people still can’t understand and explain clearly what’s online crime and even educated people, because even listen to the many news articles out there, they too can explain it.

[Jay]

Mm-hmm. OK.

[MCG]

In a way that you can say, OK, yes, he did that, you know. So however, for most part I will say no. For most part I will say no. I would not vote for offending, you know. But as we mentioned earlier, I think this is our fear.

[Jay]

Uh.

[MCG]

And Trump may still have the vote of many Christians just because they can see right through it. So yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head on that one, but to some degree, Biden had been relatively quiet about the trial, and the results. Do you think that he had the right response on this?

[Jay]

I was going to make a really mean joke and say that he can’t make a response because he’s beyond putting 2 words together to make a response, which is not nice.

[MCG]

Well, he did respond. He did respond, actually so. And I’m going to play.

[President Joe Biden]

Here response so I know this sounds bizarre. It sounds like I said this five years ago. You’d locked me up.

[Jay]

Right.

[President Joe Biden]

We gotta lock him up.

[MCG]

So there you go. Fine. Instead of you should lock him up. Lock him after he has been quiet for a while so you know.

[Jay]

I can appreciate his silence on the issue he’s speaking on it now, but I can appreciate his silence on the issue. The issue is so muddy and contorted as it is certainly don’t need his commentary on it, and he doesn’t really have room to speak considering a lot of the legal issues that. He’s staring down the barrel at, so I suppose silence is the right response.

[MCG]

Well, I don’t think he’s silent anymore. But at the point is, though again, I have no problem with locking up Trump. If Trump did the crime, he should do the.

[Jay]

Not anymore.

[MCG]

Time, yeah. But again, Biden should be lock you up because you did the crime of having classified document in the basement. What happened? You’re too old and grandfatherly. You’re not that much older than Trump. Why is that? Trump didn’t get that same treatment. What about your son, Hunter? Should we lock him up? He was convicted, and he haven’t been tried yet. He has been sentenced. That I should say. Mm-hmm. Why is he not locked up?

[Jay]

Hmm.

[MCG]

Why is Hillary Clinton not locked out? This is the one thing I don’t know why anyone would associate themselves with politicians and these powerful quote UN quote people. If you wanna put it in in that powerful. But whatever quote, UN quote, look at Hillary Clinton, how many people around her have gone to jail? How many people around Trump have gone to jail?

[Jay]

Mm-hmm. But they never. Yeah.

[MCG]

They never. Why would I want us with myself, with people like that? Then I would end up in jail. But then? No, because she can go into before Congress. And I said when they say wipe, do you mean wipe it with a cloth or whatever? She said. These kind of things, you know? Yeah, I have a problem with lock him up. But I would like to see all of them locked up who have broken the law. Prosecute all of them and I’ll be happy. And I will say, you know what, Lady Justice is blind. And balance. But I just don’t see it that way. I just don’t see that they doing it that way.

[Jay]

They’re certainly not. And what do you think that this conviction says about the direction that our country is headed in?

[MCG]

A dangerous 1A dangerous 1:00 we we persecute people based on political persuasion, attack and the party that’s in power will go after this opponent.

[Jay]

And wonder if this has been happening all of this time and now it’s only being revealed partly because of the prevalence of social media, but also because of the eroding of confidence in the institutions of this country. I wonder if that’s what’s happening here. I wonder if it’s always really been like. Yes. But now we can see it because of social media and.

[MCG]

To some degree, to some degree, politics have always been corrupt. But The thing is, America likes to sit on their high moral horse and look down. They know that Russia, China and other countries that they like to attack and say ohh, that countries, other countries that newsflash.

[Jay]

We’re not that much better.

[MCG]

Not that we’re not much better. We are not better.

[Jay]

Maybe I’m a little patriotic when I say we’re not that much better.

[MCG]

So.

[Jay]

I wonder when it comes to the direction the country is headed. The country has been slipping for quite some time, at least several decades. You know, and I always wonder if it’s too late to turn the wagon to turn the wheel, to turn it back to, or at least we can consider it to be normal, because a lot of what I’m hearing from people on the left is this whole. We’re not going back attitude. We’ve heard Kamala Harris say that many, many times. We’re not going back. We’re not going back. I think that. On the level of, say, the average person, what they’re talking about? That is, we’re not going back to what they consider to be the racist, homophobic position that Americas apparently had these past few decades. The systemically racist country. We’re not going back to that. We’re not going back to Donald Trump’s America. When was America ever great? That attitude. But I think when they say we’re not going back, I think that is perhaps. Dog whistle talk for the ruling class to say, hey, we’re not going back to this justice system that we. I can’t even say it with a straight face that we consider to be normal and functioning. We’re not going back. We’re going to continue with this political upheaval. We’re going to continue burning everything down until we can get what we want and remake this country in our own image. That’s what it seems to me that they’re saying. Of course, when they say that normal people will hear, hey, we’re not going back to 1950s. America, but what they’re really saying is, OK, we’ve torn down and we’ve discredited and we have infiltrated all these institutions. We have the control, we have the power, we’re not going back. That’s what it sounds like to me. And I think that this conviction. And served as a wake up call for people that unfortunately, we should have realized the state of national deterioration much sooner than this, and now it’s almost like a snowball going downhill. I wonder if we can ever turn it back. I.

[MCG]

Yeah.

[Jay]

Hate to sound so pessimistic.

[MCG]

Yeah. In terms of going back, I think they say that as human that the American people like where we are, where we are.

[Jay]

MHM.

[MCG]

We have arrived to this point and the American people, we like it when, quite honestly, I don’t think a lot of people like the position where the country is in terms of. Finances and the motor dead, the continent and how much money you have to pay at the grocery store for groceries and rent and mortgage rates and and the whole horse. Everything. Quite honestly, if this wasn’t Trump running, I think the Republican candidate would have been winning in a landslide just because of their last four years. I didn’t. Paris but Trump comes with a lot of baggage, and who knows, he might still win a landslide. Who knows? But she could win in this landslide, too, because there’s so much up in the air, at least in my opinion. But the conviction, do you think that this means that Trump must win, or else?

[Jay]

Uh-huh. I want to be careful using the rhetoric of or else because people will take that to. Mean that we would employ violent means in order to bring his.

[MCG]

Well, doesn’t mean he must win to avoid jail to avoid political prosecution. Does he need to win to keep his freedom? And quite honestly, his?

[Jay]

My goodness. Life if by freedom and his life we mean an extra 12 minutes. Sure, because the extent that they went to to stop this man from getting into office. I can’t imagine that they would lessen their attempts and lessen the intensity once he’s in office. There have been three public that we know of, assassination attempts on him, and I’ve heard that there are many talks about different plots being foiled that never came to the eye of mainstream media. But does he really think that they’re gonna stop going after him just because he’s in office?

[MCG]

I don’t think he thinks that. I’m just wondering, you know.

[Jay]

But there is no way, I think. Well, he has to win if he wants an extra 12 minutes of freedom and an extra 12 minutes to execute all of the things that he wants for America. But if it, if anyone thinks that somehow the law fair and the assassination attempts are going to stop once he’s in office, I think they’re sadly mistaken. What do you?

[MCG]

Think I will say yes or no? Does he must win? Yes and no. Firstly, no, because as I said earlier, if he doesn’t win, this is the end of Trump anyway, right? There’s no way he’s going to be having a campaign and running at 82. Even if he’s 82. Young like Bernie Sanders, he’s not going to be running at 82. The Democratic Party with the kicker, Bernie Sanders. He was too old. Picked up binaries to all Republican Party is most likely going to do the same thing in the 80’s. The truck working for 80 year olds running doesn’t look good, so if he doesn’t win he’s done with politics and for most part he’s no longer a threat to anybody in terms of. Them so they might just decide to drop everything if he does win. I don’t think they’re going to stop there. That’s what they think is. I’m not talking about in terms of assassination. They already impeach him twice, right. So if the house and the Senate goes to the Democrats and they have majority votes in the House, meaning at least 60 in their.

[Jay]

Yeah.

[MCG]

Senate, which is at least impossible at this point. I don’t think they’re gonna get 6. In the Senate and they win the House. Trump likely going to be impeached out of office, right? If he doesn’t win, they might just decide, give him the Biden treatment. He’s old and grandfatherly. Let him go off in the last years of his life.

[Jay]

No way, they would never.

[MCG]

To stay at Mara Lago and they probably would because he’s not a political threat anymore. They probably would. They probably would just let him fade. But here’s the thing, however, here’s something that I’m not hearing a lot of that people are talking about. If he does win, and even if they can’t veto him, they still have Section 3 of the 14 amendment.

[Jay]

They. This is.

[MCG]

That they can use against him and then go to throw everything they have at him if he does win to try to get him to go into office. So JD Vance, if he wins, you better try to prepare yourself to be actual president, because who knows, especially if they get their health insurance and they have majority vote, second entry of the voting amendment, no person shall be a senator or representative. Congress or Elector of president and vice president, or hold any office, civil or military on the United States or under any state who, having previously taken an oath as a member of Congress or as an Officer of the United States or as a member of any state legislature or as an executor. Or judicial officer of any state to support the Constitution of the United States shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the Saints or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may, by a vote of 2/3 of each house, remove such disability. January 6. Trump wins. They go to invoke Section 3 of the 14 amendment and say, hey, you started the insurrection. You’re no longer qualify to hold public office. So they’re going to be used in impeachment. If that doesn’t work, most likely they’re not gonna have the votes. If he does win, because I can’t see they having 2/3. I think with what he says here, 2/3 of both houses, I can’t see they’re having that. But if they do. He’s not going to be in there for more than a week, they’re going to remove him and once they remove him, he’s no longer a political threat to them. They does not let him spend his last days. I can’t see. They continue going and trying to get him to stuff like that because they’re going to try to at least trying to win some of his votes. Some of his voters to come over to them. I think they will declare a victory at that point. OK, Donald Trump is no more. We’re moving on. I don’t. Know.

[Jay]

Like I say, MCG, you are very optimistic. Just before we went live, I was listening to a video from Frank Schaefer, who is the son of Francis Schaeffer. Who is on the left and he talked about the reason that he’s voting for Kamala is because he wants to return to normalcy. And I suppose on one level, I understand what he’s saying because. I don’t. Think that any of us in our lifetimes have seen the President so polarizing and bringing such upheaval to the political process and into our lives, as we’ve seen in Donald Trump, but at the same time, can we really go back? Can we really go back to normalcy when we? Know barefaced about the rot and the corruption in our judicial system and our educational system, legal system, whatever system that you want to put in there, can we really go back? I don’t think that we can. And I think that as Christians, we need to take heed. And consider how should we be moving about in this time with such? Via shortcomings and corruption that need to be addressed, if we can say that we love our country and we do, what should we be doing to address this particular disease that America has? And it seems like it’s like they don’t seeped into the bones. It’s systemic this disease that we have.

[MCG]

Well. I think it all depends on what you mean by normalcy. I’m not quite sure what he meant by normalcy, but I think Persona has a lot to do with it, and Donald Trump is unfiltered.

[Jay]

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Bowling. The China shop type.

[MCG]

So. So he will say stuff and whatever rub people the wrong way. If you had listened to and I think you did, but if you had listened to. Your vice presidential debate? That was pretty civil. They disagreed, but it wasn’t, quote UN quote. Nasty in the sense that you could have cut the tension in the room with a knife. I just feel like two person disagree and that and they, they decide we’re going to agree to disagree and move on.

[Jay]

Right.

Mm-hmm.

[MCG]

And to some degree, that’s what politics was in this country. Yeah, we disagree. And we strongly disagree. But we’re not going to drag each other to the mud and to the cold. And stabbing it back in all those things, even though the evidence that some of that has been happening since the founding of the country and that’s speak to human sinful nature, right. But if the normalcy they’re talking about going back to is that I guess to some degree once the whole hacks are gone in terms of Trump, Biden. Kamala, to be honest, once they’re gone, hopefully their younger generation will come up and say, you know what, we can do things a little bit differently. I’m not hopeful for that, but you know, we’ll see, but to some extent though, all these things will Trump and over the case may. Of course we know there have been two at least 2 confirmed assassination attempts to his life. One of them people said he missed. But I.

[Jay]

Guess not a miss.

[MCG]

To some extent, I guess that wasn’t a mess, except the fact he probably was aiming center head and they’ll jump up to move his head and he clipped his ear to some degree. I’m even wondering, you know, because A223 clip in your ear, I would imagine would have done more damage than that. So I wonder if it actually didn’t hit his ear. But the 4th that go past his. Here. Caused the damage because you know these things are, you know, but I don’t know. I don’t want to say that the bullet myth. And there was just a. Force. But whatever case, maybe we know we got.

[Jay]

Confirm 223.

[MCG]

Well, it was the AR50. So 2235561 of those round usually I don’t think he was using, you know like 300 blackout or creedmore or whatever stuff like that. I think he was using the normal.

[Jay]

Everything is. Right. Normal level.

[MCG]

A fifth among even though I think he was trained in one of. But anyways, I guess the question is does the extra change attempt change anything for you or in your mind or anything?

[Jay]

You mean in terms of his?

[MCG]

Your impression of Trump? Well, voting whatever case may be.

[Jay]

Impression of Trump? It changed what I think of his opposition.

[MCG]

Do you think the opposition has something to do with this?

[Jay]

Yeah, I do. I really do. This is just my opinion. Please. YouTube don’t. Don’t come after me for this. But yeah, I really do think that the opposition has something to do with it. That’s just my personal opinion. It is not RBP’s opinion. This is my opinion, but no, it doesn’t change. My.

[MCG]

Do you realize you are our? BP, right. I do realize that.

[Jay]

No, it doesn’t change my opinion of Trump. It doesn’t change what I see to be the underlying issues that have to deal with this entire election. I guess a part of me just couldn’t believe what I was seeing. Part of me just can’t quite wrap my head around. How did we come to? This point where we’re at assassination attempts and multiple assassination attempts, but it’s nothing new, of course, but the last assassination attempt, successful assassination attempt was JFK, and that was when we 80 years ago.

[MCG]

If nothing new. More like 60 years ago, 60 didn’t.

[Jay]

60 years ago. Plus. Yes, that’s right, 1963. That’s right. So 60s ago, we’ll say ballpark there. I cannot say that I was expecting or even thinking that perhaps I would see an assassination attempt in my life. Time. But then I also didn’t think that I would witness a terrorist attack in my lifetime. A terrorist attack on American soil in my lifetime either. So I guess maybe I should have saw it coming, I should say. But no, it doesn’t change my opinion of him or change any of this at all. For me it to me, it just seems there’s a clear path forward. I don’t see how the country can heal and move forward. Without addressing. The underlying issues that we’re obviously facing, the vitriol, the hate, the lack of a common binding thread among Americans, time even in my lifetime, where there was an understanding that even if you were on opposite sides of the political divide, there’s just a certain threshold that you don’t cross. There was. There comes a point where we’re all still Americans and we’re all still in this together. That is not the case now.

[MCG]

Well, I think the last time the country probably was right, that is probably 911. And but we wouldn’t want a tragedy like that. So we can come together, but as such changed at the time. Did it change anything? No. But I think, at least for me, it didn’t. But I think it changed a lot of vote. I think this failed attempt. This failed evil attempt gained Donald Trump a lot of votes. Yes. Because especially that just the attempt.

[Jay]

So that we can come back. Right.

[MCG]

To his response. Yeah, you know, that’s not something you can rehearse that they say.

[Jay]

That’s not something you can fake either.

[MCG]

Exactly. So coming out from the Secret Service and pumping your face and say fight, fight, fight.

[Jay]

Right.

[MCG]

You know, to some extent that shows some boldness and then there was a second one at least you didn’t get any shots off. But you know, if someone had a feel excessive attempt on my life, I’ll be walking around with, you know, bulletproof vest on.

[Jay]

Can’t you be circumspect?

[MCG]

I’ll be carrying like 3-4 gardens. I’ll be going in for a fight, but this guy is still going to McDonald’s and all that stuff. And of course you have Secret Service and I know the McDonald’s suffer stage because they probably most likely search the vehicles and everything. Make sure people are going there to the drive to didn’t have. Guns and all this stuff and whatever case may be. Yeah, but I’m simply saying he’s still going out in public. He did. Went back to the same area that it happened with another campaign rally to some extent. Most people will be hiding in their basement. So. OK. But of course, most people don’t have Secret Service coverage anyway, but.

[Jay]

Perhaps what I should say then is that it didn’t change. I really don’t think that it changed how people were going to vote. I think that the country has made-up its mind.

[MCG]

No, I think he gained some.

[Jay]

No, no, no. I don’t think he gained I think. That he made it possible for people who were going to quietly vote for him anyway to feel free, to speak up and say I’m voting for Donald Trump.

[MCG]

You know, I’ve seen that social media where people come up and say, you know what, you try to kill him. That means I need to vote for him so.

[Jay]

Really. OK.

[MCG]

So I think it did change some mind how much, I don’t know. But I think you eat again.

[Jay]

Yeah. So where do we go from here? I mean, we talked about the direction of the country, we talked about how things have deteriorated and changed to the degree that we are all seeing it and we’re all in many ways caught by surprise and I’m sure many people listening would say hi didn’t catch me by surprise. Well, for the majority of Americans, I think we’re taken aback by the level of deterioration. Corruption wrought that’s in our institutions and we’re blown away. We don’t recognize the America that we knew. So where do we go from here? It seems to me that the only way to heal this is. Well, first. Judgment begins in the House of God. If things are going to change in this country, the church has to be revived, and we have to get back on the front lines. And I don’t mean in the militaristic sense. I think that we need a revival in the sense that we need to recommit ourselves to the Lord, humble ourselves before him, pray and evangelize with intensity and fervor and earnestness. For the souls that are to our left and to our right in our neighborhood. In our Jerusalem and Samaria in the uttermost parts of the world, well of the country, let’s say, because what’s happening here seems to me is a heart condition. And I think that the overwhelming majority of the population of America has a sinful heart condition. And it’s just playing out in our public institutions and in the public square. And I think that we’re surprised. By it because. As we have this veneer of holiness, we have this veneer of goodness. But we’re denying the power thereof, and I think it’s playing out on the national stage for the entire world to see. And so the only way to turn that around seems to be returning to the God who made us returning to the Savior, who died for us. I don’t know. It seems to me that once we do that. The direction of the country can change, but what do you? Think.

[MCG]

Yeah. So where do you go from here? How do we change the direction of country? So I think Christians. Are being foolish when we think that the direction of the country will change based on who’s in office. The person who is in the office of the President may slow down. But I don’t think he will change the direction of the country. So yeah, President Trump goes into office and he has his philosophy. Jill, baby, drill and energy tend to drive a lot of things. So would we see inflation come down a little bit if President Trump win? Yes. And he already promised that he’s going to. Ban transgender at least to participate in, you know, especially men saying they’re women participated in women’s sport. You where are you gonna ban? Are we going to see some of those immediate change? Yes. But you wanna slow it down because he’s only the president. He can say ban it federally, but the governors of the liberal states can decide, hey, yeah. If you are trying to. You can throw so it’s not going to change the direction of the country, you only going to slow it down. And to some extent, not to be Debbie Downer, the Bible tells us that you gonna get worse anyway before Christ come back. So my point is, Christians, we should not be fooled to think that the office of the Presidency will change the direction of country as the famous thing goes. What happened in your house is more important than what happened in the White House. And of course, we put a laid at the feet of the President of this country.

[Jay]

Mm-hmm.

[MCG]

But unfortunately, what is Kamala Harris? That Trump is the direction of the country is not going to change. Also, the problem in this country is not a political issue. We tend to think, oh, well, if he does get the right people there, it’s not a political issue. We see a lot of people, I believe, to some degree you can say they have a mental health issues. But the problem in this country is not a mental health issue. The problem is country is not even that the culture has changed the. Culture change issue? The problem is the spiritual issue in this country. And to some degree, we can say that America has left her first love. We like to both Americans, both all the time we’ve been form on the judeo-christian Foundation, Christian values and Christian Foundation. And we look back at all of those things. And if you go today, it’s mostly hide. There’s relics of evidence out there if you go to the Supreme Court building and many other government buildings, you can see evidence to some degree that this country somewhat was founded on Christian values, but they’re mostly hidden at this point. But the American, like the bowls on that fact. But evidence today we are more on a room on one track. There will any destruction, and unfortunately the politician didn’t call it and the politician cannot prevent it. We the people did cause we the people who vote them. So the politicians are corrupt, the politicians are immoral, the politicians are this that point right back to the people because we the people put that immoral, corrupt person there. So what truly can change the direction of this country? I return to the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ. That and that alone can change the direction of this country. When America returned to the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ. You know, the Bible declares in second chronicles, Chapter 7, verse 13 and 14. If I shut up heaven, that the. No rain, or if I command the low cost to devour the land, or if I send pestilence among white people. If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves and pray and seek my faith, and shall turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sins, and will heal their land. And to borrow a friend of this podcast, DW outline. And he said before we see healing of the land before we are even driven to our knees to pray. We must see the Baroness of the land. First we must see how barren our country is first, before it compel us and drive us to pray and seek God. Faith, where you will forgive us and heal on. And where we will be motivated to go there and preach a gospel than to share the gospel with other people. We have to see the barrenness of the land 1st and I’m here to say that. As Americans and a lot of Christians don’t see the barrenness of the land, so they’re not driven to pray, they’re not driven to share their fate because they don’t see the barrenness of the land. We live in a country. Where we no longer know who the boy or who is the girl. Do you see the barrenness of the land we live in a country where we glorify the killing of babies in the womb. Do you see the Baroness of the land? We live in a country we will mutilate, healthy body parts of boys and girls in the name of pseudoscience. Do you see the Baroness of the land believe in a country where Christians are more concerned about the general elections over sharing the gospel? Do you see the Baroness of the land? We live in a country where many professing Christians do not even believe the Bible. 100% thing is a certain percentage of Christians believe that portions of the Bible are not true. Do you see the Baroness of the land? We live in a country where 54% of professing Christians admits to actively view **** and get this they have no convictions about it. Do you see the Baroness of the land? And I can go on my friend. The LAN is Baron. And how can we change this Baron? Yes. Is tired with us, Christian, the Bible say if my people who are called by my name but first you must see the Baroness of the land. Second is pray. My people will call by my name, shall humble themselves and pray. And the third is obedience to the Great Commission. Let’s saturate our Jerusalem. For the Gospel of Jesus Christ, preach the word in season out of season, and when we see folks turn to Christ. Change hearts change life would lead in a change direction in this country and unfortunately. Or fortunately, as you see, Donald Trump cannot do that. Kamala Harris cannot do that. It’s only Jesus Christ.

[Jay]

This is the removing barriers podcast. If the podcast or the blog were a blessing to you, leave us a rating and a review on your favorite podcast platform. And don’t forget to share the podcast with your friends, removing barriers, a clear view of the cross.

[MCG]

Thank you for listening. To get a hold of us to support this podcast or to learn more about removing barriers, go to removingbarriers.net. This has been the removing Barriers podcast we attempted to remove barriers so that we all can have a clear view of the cross.