Episode 176

In this episode of the Removing Barriers podcast, we sit down with Dr. Scott and Tammy Pauley to uncover the invaluable lessons they’ve learned from their 27 years of marriage. They met in Bible college and jumped into ministry early on. They had to balance their relationship, their ministries, their work, and the rearing of their children. Today, they share their insights on building a strong, faith-centered marriage. Learn how to cultivate joy, maintain contentment, and keep Christ at the center of your marriage. Don’t miss this enlightening conversation.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

There’s no perfect marriage. I think sometimes people get a very dishonest view, an unrealistic view. Social media promotes that because you start looking at everybody else’s family and life, marriage and you think ohh those people have it all together.

[Jay]

Thank you for tuning in to the Removing Barriers podcast. I’m Jay and I’m MCG. And we’re attempting to remove barriers so we can all have a clear view of the cross.

[MCG]

This is episode 176 of the Removing Barriers Podcast, and this is the second in the series of Lessons in Marriage. And in this episode, we’ll be sitting down with Dr. Scott and Tammy Pauley to learn more about their 27 years of marriage and the lessons they have learned over the years.

[Jay]

Hi, this is Jay. MCG and I would like for you to help us remove barriers by going to removingbarriers.net and subscribing to receive all things, Removing Barriers. If you’d like to take your efforts a bit further and help us keep the mics on, consider donating at removingbarriers.net/donate. Removing Barriers, a clear view of the cross.

[MCG]

Dr. Scott, Mrs. Pauley. It is indeed a pleasure. Welcome to the Removing Barriers podcast.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Thank you so very much. It’s great to be. With you all.

[MCG]

Great. All right. Well, before we jump into the questions we have for marriage, tell us about your ministry Dr. Scott.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Well, Tammy and I have been serving the Lord together. Our whole married life. We met in Bible College and for nearly 20 years served with Pastor Clarence Sexton at Temple Baptist Church and Crown College. So that was a great season of ministry and involved in so many aspects of the work there. And then about nine years ago, God led us into full time evangelistic work. And so that’s been because we are traveling the country in different parts of the world, preaching the gospel, trying to encourage pastors and churches. And then in addition to that, lots of writing projects and our daily podcast media tools, that type of thing. So our work is called enjoying the journey.

[MCG]

Hey man.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Somebody years ago say they knew they were going to enjoy the destination. That’s heaven. But they thought we were supposed to enjoy the journey and trying to place an emphasis on the joy of the Lord and encouraging people along the way.

[MCG]

All right. Well, let’s start at the beginning. Tell us how we meet and stuff like that. How did this love story begin?

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Tammy won’t let you start. You tell. Me.

[Mrs. Pauley]

We were in the same friend group at college and we truly were friends. We both like different people and we of course we’re talking about them and in the course of that, getting to know each other more and hang out with other friends. Our relationship deepened and we went from. Like to love so.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

And you know, I can’t believe she ever liked somebody else. That’s the most amazing thing, but. I do think one of the joys for us, God did this for us unconscious to us is that our relationship started with friendship.

[MCG]

Yeah, man.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

And I think really friendship is the foundation of every good relationship. We set a couples now romance as people. Think of it ebbs and flows. But friendship grows and grows. So your emotions are not always the. Same. But the friendship aspect, that’s something you can build your whole life. 1. And that’s really how it started for us.

[Jay]

That sounds like a word for people who are not yet married, but looking perhaps to talk to someone, perhaps get to know someone and look at the perspective. Perhaps there might be a chance of getting married. Can you talk about in retrospect how you guys met and how your relationship came to form? Do you think that that process of how you got to know each other? Is the right way to go about it as opposed to what most people do today. They see someone they like. They automatically go into a dating phase and and things like that. So how do you think the process of getting to know one another should be? Readout.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Well, one thing I would say is I. Think. Sometimes we become so formulaic about these kinds of things we almost put God in the box where it’s always going to be a certain way. I don’t think that’s right. And I don’t think that’s really fair because God leads people differently. And so I’ve been very careful not to say, well, the way. God let us is the way God’s going to lead everybody. But I do think there’s a principle there. Pastor Sexton taught us early on that for young people, it’s good for them to develop a wide range of friendships. Instead of locking in on one person that just consumes your life early on, especially when you’re very young that you build wide-ranging friendships, he used to use the little expression where attention is given to everyone, and intention is given to no one for a season and then in time. My experience has been for us and my observation with other people and. Time. If there’s someone in that friend group that is the Lord choosing for you, then it develops. You know, the Lord starts to show that that’s really what happened for us. I mean, she said a moment ago and it’s right. She liked somebody else. I was interested in somebody else. We started talking to each other about the other people and decided we liked each other better than we liked them.

[Mrs. Pauley]

Good.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

So there is something just about spending time together and I think we used to. Spend a lot of time just talking, didn’t we?

[Mrs. Pauley]

For sure. Like people would even say things like, oh, you like each other and we’re like, no, we don’t. We’re really good friends. And then it, you know, of course, then the defense.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Though, but I think there is a principle there. That’s how you give your heart. Away.

[MCG]

Mm-hmm.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

You think of Samson, he told her all his heart. That’s why you have to be very careful who you spend. Great deal of time with and what you share. But it is true. That’s how a relationship only starts, but really develops is through conversation.

[MCG]

Yeah, definitely. Tell us a little bit more about their early years of your marriage. It’s for you, 27 years. You know, you finally got married first, you know. Tell us about the early. Years of marriage.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Well, I probably should let Tammy answer that question about all the things she had to straighten out in me. The first few. Years, but we got married on Friday the 13th.

[MCG]

Ohh wow.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

The lucky day for me, let me tell you. And we were young, you know, starting out immediately, we started serving in ministry. So that was, I would say, a lot of. That’s not, I don’t know. How would you summarize the early years of our marriage?

[Mrs. Pauley]

Busy was very busy, especially when we, as say Morgan, came along 2 1/2 years after we were married. And so yeah, we were very busy serving and of course we loved being where we were and I’m just trying to think. That would be the the focus of trying to tell somebody else about those early years. So of course, when you have younger children, you’re home a lot. Yes, but Scott always included me and what we were doing because when you’re at home with your children, that’s what God’s given you to do. But yet we also were serving in the ministry at the church and he would try to include me as much as he could. And we would try to, you know, if there was something I could have somebody watch the children or whatever. But at the same time, we would take the kids with us. Of course, and we just enjoyed that those those years for sure.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

We did. And I would say she’s right. It was a very busy season. I mean, we’re busy now, but that was good for us because we had to learn how to balance marriage work. Children. And isn’t that everybody’s struggle? You know, every couple I talk to is trying to figure.

[MCG]

Yep.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Out that tension. And it’s part of life. It doesn’t go away. You just you learn to adjust and you learn to prioritize. And I think we had to learn that very early on in our marriage.

[Jay]

So what advice would you give to couples in their first five to seven years where they’re in that busy schedule or busy time of life and little children are involved in serving and ministry and all of these things that you described that you had to iron through, what would be some advice that you would share for couples that are just in their first five to seven years?

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Well, this may not sound very spiritual, but I would say have fun. I think there’s a lot of adjustment in married life. There’s certainly adjustment when the kids come along, like someone said, as a series of adjustments. That’s true. But I think one thing that we learned from our parents and then through experience was we tried to have a happy. Be home and have a good time together. We we didn’t have a lot of money. You know? It wasn’t like we could do exorbitant things. We were just times, you know, trying to get a few dollars together to go fund and get a hamburger. But we had fun and I think sometimes couples get so busy working. And so worried about everything that they stop enjoying each other, and they stop enjoying life and it becomes miserable. I’ve said to people often my parents just celebrated their 51st wedding anniversary last week. In fact, both of our parents have been married for over half a century, which is very unusual. And I’ve told people, though, for my parents, the greatest thing they gave me growing up, me and my sister was a happy home. It wasn’t. The rules? It wasn’t the material things, it was the joy of the Lord. Because when you grow up in a happy home, you want more of that and you want that for your marriage and for your children. And so that’s really something we tried to work on and I would recommend that to people.

[MCG]

Yeah, definitely. Tell us about your boat, New Testament marriage and how can folks get? A copy of that book.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Sure. Why don’t you tell them the inception of the book? Because. Just wrote it recently, but this goes back years. Tell them how.

[Mrs. Pauley]

So we worked with a Sunday school class with 20 couples and Scott did a little spotlight in Sunday school that each couple would pick somebody that was a favorite couple in the Bible. And of course, Scott was trying to teach some things about couples in the Bible. And so Aquila and Priscilla became our favorite couple in the Bible and. We learned a lot about them and that’s. Really, how the book came.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

About. Yeah. So for years I have enjoyed studying Aquila and Priscilla. They’re very neglected. I think by most people, but it may surprise folks to know they’re found in six different places and in four different New Testament. Looks so both Luke and Paul over a span of 15 to 20 years referenced this same husband and wife. Mean and every time one of them is mentioned, the other one is always. Mentioned. Which is very interesting. Sometimes Priscilla’s name is mentioned first, which is really interesting. Talk about that in the book. But we identified 7 principles from their marriage that we believe is a model for New Testament marriage, and it really is all about how to connect your family. To God’s family and your home to what the Lord is doing through the local New Testament church. And I really believe when you get those two God ordain institutions connected to one another, both of them are strengthened. About that. So that really is what the book is all about. It’s a book for young men and women who are praying about marriage. It’s a book for not just young married couples, but people have been married for years because frankly, all of us can take our marriage to another level. And so I would love for folks to get it. It’s called New Testament marriage lessons from Aquila and Priscilla. There’s several ways to get it, but if you go to enjoyingthejourney.org, that’s our website, enjoyingthejourney.org. Or etj dot Bible. You’ll see the book there and you can find all the resources it’s available, audiobook format and audible. It’s available on Apple Books and Kindle. It’s available for free PDF download on our website or the paperback copy, and we’ve printed it in such a way so that people could get them in bulk and study them with a class. So if there’s a group of couples they want to study together, it would be a great resource for that. And it’s made like a workbook. So you could write in it and and make it your own. And we’re just trying to encourage husbands and wives to start having discussions about if their marriage really models what is seen in the new test.

[MCG]

And then give us a sneak peek. What are the first maybe 2 principles?

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

OK. So well, the first principle I alluded to a moment ago, Chapter 1 is called together and one is never mentioned without the other. It’s rid of the Bible principle of oneness. The divine math is 1 + 1 = 1, and you find that in Genesis 1.

[MCG]

Hmm.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

So one in spirit, one in soul, one in body. What does that look like? And you know, they say opposites attract. I think there’s a lot of truth. And that that really is one of the reasons I think Priscilla’s name is mentioned 1st, about half of the time, most Bible teachers believe she may have been the more outgoing vocal of the two. She may have been the more gifted of the two. Maybe she was the one when they walked in the room. Everybody noticed her first and Aquilla, God bless him, was more of a. As they say, a wallflower. I don’t know, but I know this. It’s really not about personality. It’s about spirituality. So you could be very different. God made us uniquely. But when you serve together, you complete one. Another and as a team, you serve the Lord. That’s the first lesson. The second lesson is one of my favorites. It’s called a Christian home in Corinth, and the first time we are introduced to a color, Priscilla, they are living and working in one of the most ungodly cities in the Roman. Empire. And idols everywhere, immorality opened in the streets. And yet, to me, there’s great hope there, because what it means is you can have a Christian home even. Correct. And we talk about that. And so those are the kinds of lessons that. Are found in the book.

[MCG]

I mean sound interesting? Definitely going to get ourselves some copies.

[Jay]

Absolutely. And we encourage our listeners to do the same. So let’s do a little bit of a pivot and talk more about you mentioned the joy of the Lord being something that we should aim for and something that should characterize our homes and our marriages. What are some of the things that you have done to put Christ in the place that he should be to keep him first in your marriage? And obviously the joy of the Lord would be a result of that. So what are the things that you’ve done in your marriage to keep Christ? 1st.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Oh, so many things come to my mind and some of them not because we’ve done them well, but because we need to work on them. So you know, nobody’s a perfect example of all this. Tammy, give them one or two things that you think we’ve tried to do in our home with our children or in our marriage. Just try to keep the spirit right.

[Mrs. Pauley]

Well, of course, anytime the church doors are opened. We would definitely be there and that we would make it that there was something we get to do, we get to serve the Lord, not a judge. 3 and especially too when Scott was busy, like he would be away, you know, away sometimes even out of town or in the church. You know, an evening something I couldn’t participate in, always never making it look like. Oh, Daddy’s doing this. And that’s terrible, you know, is always just saying, daddy, we get to do this. For the Lord and. Always. Honoring Christ 1st and of course personal walk. You know, first and foremost, that’s a given, but. Making the whole a haven and the fact that that you exemplify Christ in the home, not just in front of people, so to speak, that you try to solve this problem. Well, let’s pray about it. Let’s find you know what the Lord wants us to do.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

You know, and Tammy’s done a good job of keeping the spirit of our home right. I think a wife and mother is a powerful person in the family. And, you know, men are called to lead their homes spiritually. But I’m convinced that the wife. And. Mother very often as the one who sets the tone in the home, and Tammy’s done a good job of that, keeping home happy. And, as she said, accentuating the positives people say to me, oh, serving the Lord or traveling so much that that must be so difficult. But in reality, there’s challenges in anything you do. You know your listeners are a wide range of people in a variety of work. Everything has its challenges and you learn in life to accentuate the positives and minimize the negatives. You don’t talk about the negatives all the time. You talk about the goodness of God. And so I think that was a key element in our home and something we had to learn over time.

[MCG]

Yeah. Let me ask this more and maybe on a personal level because I wasn’t born and raised in a Christian homes. I’m always curious about this. How did you go about doing like family devotions and stuff like that? Did you have, like, a formuler that you use or some kind of pattern or whatever? How did you go about doing that? I’m sure family devotion probably was one of those key factors in your home as well.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

So let me say this first. I believe that family worship is important and that’s the term I like to use. You know the word devotions. I’m not gonna crusade against it, but the word devotions is only found one time in the Bible on its negatives. It’s in the book of acts. Mars hill. He beheld their devotions to an unknown God. I think sometimes devotions become the goal. And they become almost empty ritual religious routine. The goal really is family worship, and that permeates whole life. Connecting the family to the church, to corporate worship and the thing I like about that emphasis is that it’s less about OK, kids, we’re going to give God 10 minutes today and more about Deuteronomy 6. We’re going to talk about it when we drive down the road in the car. When we’re sitting at the dinner table, you try to weave. This spiritual emphasis into the whole conversation and the whole fabric of your home, not just giving God a portion of it. So I’m not against what we call family devotions, but I think we’ve got to keep in perspective the goal of that is really just to bring the right spiritual tone into every part of family. My life, that being said, I would say we were never great at what people refer to as traditional family devotions, meaning that every morning or every night we spent 15 minutes and read this many chapters and followed this pattern. We I I think would have been more hit and miss. With that, our schedules were crazy to start with, and so we had to work at that really hard, especially with me out of town so much and the type of thing. But we did different things at different seasons. For example, tell them what we did when the kids were were very young, when they were little children. I’ve always said that families, if you have little babies and little toddlers and early elementary, don’t try to have a 30 minute church service with them and it’s not going to happen. You don’t take off. Giving invitation all that every day, but tell what we.

[Mrs. Pauley]

Did well, you know, Bible stories talk about the Bible stories. Yeah. And that was a big thing. We did have a few books that we had found that were very age appropriate to very small children. That we really enjoyed, you know, just trying to give them something for the day, just like, you know, and to emphasize that they needed to do that on their own too, you know, on their.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Own. So we started early on with the Bible stories as the kids got older. You know, oftentimes it was just a verse or a thought. And I’m sure we should have been much more. Consistent about that, but at one point when they became older team. Teens. We have three teenagers at the same time. Can you imagine? But we reached a place where they all had mobile devices. That’s a different discussion. And it was it was. Much later. We didn’t do that early on. But when they finally all had mobile devices for a season, because I was traveling a lot, we were scattered. We would all share something on a little text. Read every day a verse. That we had read that day and what it meant to us, I would say this, the goal of family devotions is to encourage personal devotions. The goal of worshiping with your children is to teach them to study God’s word and pray for themselves. So our aim was always to get them to the place where they were in God’s word themselves, not just that we were spoon feeding them.

[Jay]

Wonderful. I don’t know if you know this, but there is a meme floating around on the Internet of a picture of dinosaurs. It’s T Rex, it’s. And half top half is a Toy Story dinosaur. They all happy and just smiling. It’s toy and then on the bottom is the like the mean Jurassic Park T Rex. And at the top you have mom out in public and at the bottom it’s mom at home. And so Dr. Pauley, you mentioned how the wife and the mother keeps the tone of the home and keeps that spiritual sort of. Happy, joyful environment going on in the home. If I could ask you, I’m gonna thread all these things to. Another you know, 80% of divorces, apparently are initiated by women in the country today, and 50% of the country is above 50% in terms of divorce rates. And so it looks like the women are for some reason very unhappy and leaving their marriages. What would you say in light of the woman, keep the spiritual joy and the environment in the home? What has kept you in your marriage with the divorce? Being as crazy as it is, and how would you recommend that we manage the craziness, the business, the children, the responsibilities, all these things that could pick away at our marriages and encourage divorce? What are some of those things that have kept you in your marriage, kept the sweet spirit at home and keep you in your?

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

That’s a great question. That’s probably what we could talk about for a long time. Let me give one because I think sometimes simple is better and the one thing that comes to my mind is the principle of contentment. I think by and large, the reason people start looking elsewhere for happiness or thinking they have to get out of it. Relationship. Find. Someone better do something. Different is because they really are not content. Now there’s a healthy discontentment for ourselves, meaning we ought to be growing and wanting to be more what we ought to be, and we’ve not arrived. But there is a contentment in Christ, and there’s a contentment in what God chooses for us. That I think is so beautiful and wonderful. When people learn to discover it and it is something. Earned contentment is not a lightning bolt out of heaven, Paul said. I have learned in whatsoever state I am therewith to be content, then in the next verse, he says. I am instructed. It sounds to me like he learned it and he’s. Continuing. To learn it, so every day we’re learning, be content in Christ, be content in your marriage, be content with where.

[MCG]

Amen.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

God has you right now be content with the opportunities that God has put in front of you and find your joy in the Lord. And I think that’s something going back to where you started this question with wives that I would say about my wife is she’s a very contented person and I understand everybody’s personality is different. But my wife is a person who enjoys life, enjoys the family, enjoys little things and is content. And I think that really is rooted. In your spiritual walk and finding your sufficiency in Jesus.

[MCG]

Man, alright, why don’t we go into a little bit of a break and then we come back at other side with some last couple of questions. You’re listening to the Removing Barriers podcast. We’re sitting down with Dr. Scott and Miss Tammy Pauley and you’re learning all about their 27 years of marriage. We’ll be right back.

[Jay]

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[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Several years ago, Tammy and I had the privilege of working with young married couples. That was very good for us because during that season we started to identify the married couples of the Bible as so much can be learned from their lives. And we landed on a favorite we we really came to love Aquilla and Priscilla. They’re mentioned six times in four different New Testament books. And there are so many wonderful lessons from their life. This is why I wrote this book on a New Testament. Marriage lessons from Aquila and Priscilla’s marriage is under attack, but the word of God has not change. I hope you’ll order a copy of this brand new book study with your spouse and study with other couples. May God give us a real revival of New Testament marriages.

[MCG]

All right. Well, let’s jump back into it. What would you say are some of the biggest obstacles in your marriage, and how did you overcome them? They don’t have to spell your dirty laundry to everybody, but.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

That’s a great question. I don’t know what would you say to the biggest obstacle? Me.

[Mrs. Pauley]

No.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Since you beat me into submission, I don’t know. What would you?

[Mrs. Pauley]

Say, then I would probably repeated that about the business, but you know, staying on the same page and I was going to say too earlier when Scott would get home from his day, he was 100% home. And I know that wasn’t easy because, you know, the things that he might go through his day and the stress of something. Many things you would give 100% to us, and even when he was tired and that was just always such a blessing. And he, you know, keeping us on the same. Page together. That was definitely.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

I think staying connected is really the greatest obstacle everybody faces because there’s so many distractions. And do you have them outside the home, work, family life? Then you get home and there’s distractions at home too. Media, you know, even the needs of your children can be so demanding. As they grow different phases, you have to be intentional. I think that’s the big thing. You have to talk. You have to spend time together. You can’t just sit in the same room and look at the same screen to be on the same page, you have to communicate and I think that’s probably is the biggest obstacle we all deal with laying down the devices, having an old-fashioned conversation and taking a walk. Tammy got me drinking coffee years ago. She got me addicted. So one of our things that we enjoy doing though we love to find a coffee shop and sit down and have a cup of coffee, it has to be long. It could be 5 minutes, 10 minutes, but sometimes those are opportunities to reconnect. And talk a little more deeply than just surface.

[Jay]

I love that. I think I already know the answer to this question, but I’m going to ask it anyway. Would you do it all over again, and if so, why?

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

I’d like to hear Tammy’s. Answer to that question.

[Mrs. Pauley]

Well, of course. And you know that once again the Lord put us together. You know, he makes everything perfect. So the life isn’t perfect and we are perfect. Our Lord is. And so yes, of course we would.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Do it. Yes. And I think that’s a good point. What you just said. There’s no perfect marriage, I think sometimes. People get a very. This honest view, an unrealistic view. Social media promotes that because you start looking at everybody else’s family and life, marriage and you think of those people have it all together. Well, usually those very people coming apart at the seams. Everybody’s got problems, everybody’s got struggles and stress. So there is no perfect situation. But I do believe God’s choice is perfect. His way is perfect and so my answer to that is yes for the same reason it was the will of God that he put us together there. And I remember my pastor saying to me, boy, Scott, God gave you the perfect wife for you. And he was right. And the longer we’ve been married, the more convinced I am of that. So that’s a great blessing for which we’re grateful.

[MCG]

Man. All right, so this question is for you, Miss Tammy. The Bible says in Ephesians, chapter 5, verse 22 to 24 wives, submit yourself unto your own husbands as unto the Lord for the husband and the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church, and he is the savior of the body. Therefore, as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their husbands. In everything. How have you shown respect and submission to your husband over the years?

[Mrs. Pauley]

I think most of all, whatever decision needs to be made in the home or whatever that we’re doing, I just always left it to Scott. He always included me in decisions, I have to say. I never felt like, you know, that it was important what I thought. Or having an input, but in the end it was always his decision and he would say the two of us made it together. And I really think that but. Ultimately, he made the decisions whether it came to, you know, purchases or to our children. Whatever it was, he’s the leader of the home, and that’s what God intended. So.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

If I could answer from my perspective of that question, the greatest way I think that she has has shown that is in even the way. She speaks to me. There’s a respectfulness and I hope it’s a mutual respect. But even in the way she would address me in front of our children, or if we had a disagreement about something, she was very careful about that to show the right spirit.

[Jay]

Dr. Pauley, this question is for you. Ephesians 2. Continuing in that same chapter or I’m sorry. Ephesians 5, I’m tripping over my words here. Continuing with that same verse continues to verse 29 husbands love your wives even as Christ also loved the church and gave himself for it, that he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of the water. By the word that he might present it to himself a glorious church not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that it should be holy and without blemish, so ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife Loveth himself, for no man ever yet hated his own flesh but nourished and. Perisheth it even as the Lord, the church. What practical things are you doing to both love your wife and show her that you love her as Christ loves the church?

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Well. 1st I would say I need to do much better at that. I don’t know that any of us measure up to that. One simple thing is I stay in constant contact with her. You know, I travel a lot. She’s with me much more now than she ever was able to before. But we talked many times through the day. And part of that is I want to check on her and hear her voice. Part of it is I want her to know I’m interested and I’m available. And I think that expresses love and affects you. We always say I love you when we leave one another, when we get off the phone and then I’m learning instead of saying I have learned, I’m learning. It’s the simple things. You know, men, we think affection is expressed in intimacy and, you know, physical contact and all that. But through the years, I hope, as I’ve matured as a husband, I’m learning that for a wife that is much more expressed through little gestures and. So I’m sure I should bring flowers more of that type of thing. But when I’m home like this morning, you know, this seems silly, but I try to make. The. Bed. She does a lot around the house. I don’t do a whole lot of house work. Probably should do more. Don’t same in there. But that’s one thing I can do, you know? And so I made the bed. And I try to do that with some regularity and of course I always make a joke about it. Call attention to it and want to get credit for it. Like all husbands do. But it’s the little things that I think that I’m learning that express my genuine love and desire to help.

[MCG]

I wonder if you could help me with my interpretation because. That the husband got there had a command. The husband had told to love their wives, even as Christ loved the church, and the wife is just said, well, the submit who has the higher command, Dr. Pauley help us.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Here, here’s what I know. I know they both have one thing in common, both of them. Christ is the example.

[MCG]

Hey man.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

And so to me, that’s interesting. You know, wives are never commanded to love. Because I think when we love like we ought to, they respond in kind. But I do believe the common denominator is what you got to concentrate on, which is we’re the love is Christ. They’re just a bit as Christ. If we’re all more Christlike, then marriage is a much happier thing.

[MCG]

Hey man.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

And that’s really the goal.

[MCG]

Amen. All right, well, let’s wrap it up with Ephesians, Chapter 5, continuing to rest 31 and verse 32 for this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto. His wife, and they too shall be one flesh. This is a great mystery, but I speak concerning Christ and the church. Both of you can answer this question. What do you want the world to know about Christ and his? Church. As demonstrated through your marriage.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

That’s a wonderful question. That’s a theological question. I would say that our desire is we would love for people to look at our lives and our marriage and want to know our Christ. I really believe, you know, we talk a lot about testimony. Christian witness, I think a true Christian marriage is one of the greatest. Christian witnesses there. This think though, there’s no perfect marriage. If our marriage is for love to be people will want to know not just some formula. You know, there’s so many New York Times best selling books on how to have a happier life and a better marriage. 7 steps to strengthen your relationship. And all of this. But in the end, it ought to be no. We’re not trying to draw people to ourselves. We’re trying to point people to Jesus and as an evangelist, that’s really my passion. That’s what we’re trying to give our life to. We want people to know Christ. Least, and I think the right kind of marriage will exemplify that and point people to.

[MCG]

Amen. Anything to add, Mrs. Tammy?

[Mrs. Pauley]

Well said.

[MCG]

All right.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

She writes it all and. I repeat what she wrote.

[MCG]

Well, Dr. Scott, Ms. Tammy. Thank you very much for joining us on the Removing Barriers podcasts.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

It’s been our privilege. Thank you for having us. And I would say this to your listeners, we have a lot of marriage helps and additional biblestudies@enjoyingthejourney.org that folks can listen to, watch and read and all the resources are free. So if that’s a tool that can be a benefit to other families, we will offer.

[Mrs. Pauley]

Yes.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

Do them.

[MCG]

I’m not gonna both get ahold of your podcast. I know you have a podcast. Is it available in everywhere? Podcast can be found.

[Dr. Scott Pauley]

It is on all the podcast platforms, just search for join the journey.

[MCG]

All right. Well, thank you very much.

[Dr. Scott Pauley], [Mrs. Pauley]

Thank you!

[MCG]

Hey this is MCG. Jay and I would like to thank you for listening to the end of this episode. The 1st 2 listeners who request a copy of Dr. Pauley’s new book New Testament Marriage will receive a copy as a free gift from us. You may contact us by going to removingbarriers.net/contact and reach out to us by one of the many means listed on that page.

[Jay]

Hey, thanks so much for listening to the Removing Barriers podcast. Did you know that you could find us on Twitter, Gab Parlor, Facebook and Reddit, go to removingbarriers.net/contact and like and follow us on social media, removing barriers? A clear view of the cross.

[MCG]

Thank you for listening. To get a hold of us to support this podcast or to learn more about removing barriers. Go to: removingbarriers.net. This has been the removing Barriers podcast we attempted to remove barriers so that we all can have a clear view of the cross.