Episode 120

The accidental shooting death of Halyna Hutchins on the set of the film Rust made international headlines and sparked debate across the country on guns, gun control, and the application of the law dependent on class or status. Alec Baldwin made some fantastic claims about the circumstances of that day, namely that he was not responsible because he never pulled the trigger, that the gun went off on its own, and the single most important issue was to determine where the live round came from. Join us on this episode of the Removing Barriers podcast as we dissect what happened and share our opinions on all these topics and more.

We did not have a problem. I mean, I understand there was an accidental discharge at one point on the set of a blank round, but we did not have a problem for me until that day. Everything gets slowed down. The Zapruder film is here. And the issue with that is there’s only one question to be resolved, only one, and that is where did the live round come from?

Thank you for tuning in to the Removing Barriers podcast. I’m Jay and I’m Meg and we’re attempting to remove barriers so we can all have a clear view of the cross.

This is episode 120 of the Removing Barriers Podcast. And in this episode we will finally discuss the tragic incident surrounding the fatal shooting of Halyna Hutchins and the shooting injury of Joel Souza on October 21st, 2021, while under Russ movie set in New Mexico. The 45 Colt revolver used as a prop was discharged by the producer and star actor Alec Baldwin while he was rehearsing a scene.

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All right, Jay, before we get into gun safety and everything, let’s talk a little bit more about the background of this shooting that occurred on October 21st, 2021. Yeah, in October of 2021, the cinematographer for the movie Rust that was being produced by Alec Baldwin was shot and killed. You mentioned her name was Halyna Hutchins. She was shot and killed. And the director, Joel Souza, was wounded when the prop gun that Alec Baldwin was holding in, rehearsing for a scene went off. It fired and the bullet went through Helena through her side, like from right to left, exited her body, entered Joel Souza’s left shoulder area, wounded him. And after quite a few minutes, I want to say it was somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 to 40 minutes before she could get removed and taken to a medical facility for treatment. But she didn’t make it. She died and Joel Souza was wounded, taken to the hospital. In the aftermath, Alec Baldwin insists that he did not pull the trigger of the gun. The gun went off on its own. And even before that, when the armorer or the prop master handed him the gun, he claims that she told him that the gun was, quote, cold or that the weapon had no ammunition of any sort in it, whether it’s a dummy round or a blank or a live round, nothing. And so, according to his retelling of the story, he was completely surprised when it went off because he understood that it was a cold weapon, whatever cold means anyway, and that he’d never pulled the trigger and that he is not responsible for her death he is currently being charged with. Actually, I was surprised to follow up on this and find that he’s being criminally charged with manslaughter, two counts of manslaughter, which I hope that we can talk about later, because how could it be manslaughter if the person’s not dead, but he’s being criminally charged now. And so some of the questions that people have are, can the weapon actually fire without the trigger having been pulled? Who’s responsible for her death considering how the armorer is responsible for both the weapon and the ammo? And what does that mean for the wider, broader application of weapons in the United States? Because as charged a topic as weapons and guns are in this country, there’s inevitably going to be fallout that reaches the average citizen as a result of how this case is handled legally? I think so anyway.

Yeah. So you did mention that Alec Baldwin said that when he was handed a gun, someone told him that it was cold and he kind of go into what a cold gun mean for my research. Cold Gun on a movie set can mean two things. It could mean that the gun is totally empty or it is loaded with dummy rounds and dummy rounds simply means that there’s no gunpowder, there’s no charge in the ammo. So you pull the trigger on the ammo and nothing happens. And also you have what you call dummy rounds. Dummy rounds are not dummy rounds, but what they call blanks, where you have a wad in place of a round, a actual bullet. Of course, a lot of times we call the whole thing a bullet. But the bullet is actually just the top part of the round that’s kind of sticking out of the casing. So part of the bullet is being pulled together by the casing. And of course, you have the primer and the. Gunpowder and all these things. All those things Behind the bullet. Behind the bullet. You have the inside the shell that make up what we call a round or cartridge. So a blank simply has the gunpowder. Sometimes it’s not a full load. It’s just enough for you to have the effect of a gun being fired, whether it’s a muzzle flash or whatever, because the bang and the smoke. Right. Because realistic as and the casing popping out make it look as real as possible. So because on movie sets, sometimes they do up close shots, especially with revolvers, because with revolvers you can actually see the bullet in the gun or the round in the gun. So if there’s a close up, sometimes they don’t want you to notice that it’s not a real bullet or a real round. You don’t want to see that there’s no primer in it, or so they want it to look as realistic as possible. So I think when she told him coal Gun was that it was blanks and that’s what he expected to be in the gun blanks and not actually a real gun. But let’s go into a little bit of gun safety because I think we’re going to come back often to gun safety. And what are some of the universal safety rules for guns and stuff like that. But before we do that, I also want to mention that the day before or the day of I think was the day before this incident happened, there were multiple communication about safety issues on set. They seemed to had a number of incidents where guns went off. These were actually three separate incidents, if I remember. BLANKS Yes. But he was actually blanks. And they were also money issues and working conditions, issues that were kind of going on. So I think more than half of the film crew quit because they had to drive all the way from Albuquerque an hour away or something like that, and only getting five hours of sleep. Right. And working 12, 13 hours days. So there was a lot of issues back and forth on the set.

Not sure if all of these are related, but let’s talk about gun safety a little bit, because, you know, the NRA has for safety rules for firearms. Do you want to tell us what those are? Well, I don’t know what the NRA safety rules are. I’m probably going to get them here. But from what I understand, I remember that the first rule of weapon safety is to treat every weapon as if it were loaded. Secondly, you never want to point the weapon at anything you don’t intend to shoot. So basically, don’t point the weapon at anyone unless you’re ready to engage. You want to keep your fingers, your trigger finger straight and off the trigger until you’re ready to fire. Don’t pull the trigger unless you’re ready to destroy something. And you also want to make sure that you know what your target is and what’s behind it. Those are the weapons safety that I know. I know different groups have different ideas of what weapon safety are, but those are the four basic ones that I’m familiar with. Yeah, and those are the four basic rules of NRA safety rules. Yeah, of course. You know, if you go on YouTube, you can find people like John Career who say that they’re not for their three safety rules. And then you have folks like Mr. Gunzinger on YouTube as well that kind of condense them down to two. But I think overall it’s simple. Keep your finger off the trigger. You know, don’t put your finger on the trigger. The gun wouldn’t go bang. And the important thing here also that firearms today tend to be very safe. They would not fire unless you pull that trigger because a lot of them have stuff to block the striker or the block the hammer from hitting the primer when the trigger is not being pulled. I know Glocks have that in their Smith and Wesson, NPS and stuff like that. Most of them most modern pistol firearm today, if not all, have some sort of trigger block trigger protection to prevent the gun from firing if the trigger is not being pulled. So most of the time you have to be intentional pull of the trigger. Now, the argument here is that he was not using a modern weapon.

He was not using a weapon that we would imagine has those safety or people who don’t know about guns would say this weapon that he had this copy of a colt does not have those safety features. Is that true? Or is it true that it’s a revolver and it behaves differently from a semi-automatic? Or I guess what I’m asking is, is it possible for what Alec Baldwin said happened to actually happen? He said he never actually pulled the trigger and the weapon went off by itself when he was pulling back the hammer. And when he released the hammer, he says that’s when the gun went off. You know, initially when this happened and I heard what happened and heard Alec Baldwin, I think he was on George Stephanopoulos talking about this. And I had some clips of that that I will probably play a bit later. But when I heard him talk about it, I first gave him the benefit of the doubt because, yeah, if you’re trying to mimic a Western style movie and you have those old Western single action revolvers, you could argue that maybe they didn’t have all the safety, but I don’t think it was a true all Western type gun. It was like a replica. So it was the Colt 45 revolver. And the FBI did extensive tests on this weapon and said that it could not have fired without the trigger being pulled, the actual weapon that was on the set. Yes. So the FBI did some tests on that. Now, before our last fishing accident, we had guns in our home and you forced me to take all the weapons. And then we lose them in the fishing boating accident. Yeah, but before that, you know, I had. Or have a single action revolver is not the pair, the Colt 45. But I can tell you this much, when you pack it all the way back, the trigger is probably £3 is very light. Light. It’s very light. So you can barely touch that thing before it goes off. So that’s what I believe happened with Alec Baldwin. I think that he pulled the hammer all the way back. And because there are images out there, there are pictures out there of him with the gun, with his finger on the trigger. So if it’s £3 and I’m guessing for this gun, I don’t know how much pounds it is when it’s fully cocked, but if it’s £3, single action, that’s nothing to accidentally discharge. If your fingers on the trigger, especially if you’re joined from concealment or joined from under a jacket or whatever he had on during the set and swinging around it is easy mechanically for your finger if he’s on the trigger to grasp the trigger and the gun goes off because £3 is not heavy. Like for instance, again, I had a I’ll have a double action single action revolver. So this is a different one. This one can fire either in double action or single action and double action. This thing is like £10. It’s a very heavy, heavy trigger. But when you put it in single action mode, again, it’s about £3. That is amazing. And that’s not true only for revolvers. You can go to semi-automatics where you have guns, where you can fire it in double action mode. And then after the slide cycle, once all the preceding shots will be in single action mode, the single action mode is usually probably less than half the pounds of the double action mode is a much shorter pull. And if you’re not practicing with your weapon, you don’t know your weapons well enough. That first shot or the second shot can throw you off because you wouldn’t expect the gun to fire that quickly because the weight of the trigger just is much smaller when it is in single action mode. And that’s true for revolvers, You know, so I think Alec Baldwin, because he cocked it all the way back now, the gun fire, because the trigger is so light.

I think also what may have confused him because a lot of these single action revolvers, unlike the one I have or had the hammer, have several different positions, positions, that’s a good word position that it can be in. Like, for instance, in order for you to load this weapon I’ve been talking about the one I have or had. In order for you to load it, you have to pull the hammer to the first position. Then you open a little gate and you can put your ammo in. But if you pull the trigger on it, at that level, nothing happened because the trigger is not engaged. Actually, the trigger is dead. You can’t pull the trigger at that level. Then he has a second level that he goes back to. I don’t know what the purpose for that one is, but it still can pull the trigger. Then you have to pull the trigger all the way back a fully cocked the weapon before you can fire. I think Alec Baldwin may have cocked the weapon, but not cocked it all the way back. Oh, nothing happened. But this time, because in his own words, he said he cocked it all the way back. This time I think he and with his finger touching the trigger or whatever, the gun went off. So I think for him, it was probably lack of firearm knowledge that caused this lack of knowing the weapon that he’s handling. If you’re going to handle a weapon, understand how the weapon works. And also he break all the rules of gun safety.

You know, he didn’t treat the gun like his. It was loaded. And I get it. He was told he wasn’t. But, you know, he was pointing it at someone and all these things that were happening that if he had follow at least keeping your finger off the trigger, that would not have happened. So I guess that goes into who is to be blamed for this shooting. You know, is it Alec Baldwin, is it the armorer? Who do you blame? I would place, of course, having not been there, I would say that the blame squarely rests on Baldwin’s shoulders. But the armorer, I believe, has responsibility for the shooting as well. You mentioned MG that he broke all of the rules of gun safety and he had the weapon pointed at someone. He had his finger on the trigger. He did not treat that weapon as if it were loaded. And if you listen to the interview with Stephanopoulos, he didn’t know what his target was. He said that he didn’t know that the weapon was pointed at Helena until afterward, when he realized that’s obviously where the weapon had been pointed. And I do remember him in an interview saying that he never pointed the weapon at her as well. So that’s a discrepancy there that probably needs to be resolved in court somewhere. Both of those things can’t be true at the same time. And so the blame rests on his shoulders. In his interviews, he was adamant that he has been handling weapons, particularly on set in his films, for a very long time. And so he’s very well versed in the rules of weapon safety and handling weapons. And so for someone that supposedly has all of that knowledge and all of that. Understanding and training in weapons. He certainly handled that weapon that day, like someone who either didn’t know the rules or didn’t know the importance of weapons safety even on set, or he was completely lax, as perhaps a lot of the accusations about or concerns about safety that were brought up by other members of the crew of the film they brought up. So he was either ignorant or he was completely lax and perhaps even arrogant. We also have to scrutinize the armorer because she is responsible or was responsible for the condition of the weapon and accountability for the ammunition and for the state of the weapon, even though Alec Baldwin himself is also responsible for that, because when someone hands you a weapon, you don’t just assume that what they’re saying is true. You have to check it for yourself. I don’t know if those rules are different on a movie set, but from what I understand she’s responsible for. In fact, let me read to you what the responsibility of the Armorer is. According to the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers, this is from Wikipedia. After the death of Brandon Lee, who was killed on set. This is Bruce Lee’s son was killed on set of the movie, I believe it was called Raven or Crow. It was a movie called Crow when Brandon Lee was killed in 1993 from a blank that had gone off from around this organization required that someone be certified for the weapon and use to be present at all times. So the armorer physically has to be there. When the weapon is being used, the weapon must be checked before and after each take. The firearms must be cleaned every day. It must be stored securely by the props master. When not in use, loaded weapons must never be pointed at any one. Protective clothing must be worn by everyone nearby when blanks are fired and if the weapon is to be fired directly at the camera, they are supposed to erect a plexiglass or shield of some sort and only the person certified for the weapon or someone under that person’s direct supervision may hand the weapon to the actor. That’s according to the rules of the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television producers. From what I understand, many of the information that has come out, many of these things were not done. These weapons in some cases were not checked. Obviously, it wasn’t checked in this particular instance.

And there’s also another question that really needs to be answered. How did live ammunition make its way to the set in any capacity? How is it that a live round for that weapon, for that specific weapon was not just in the weapon at that time, but how did it even make it to the set? Why is there even live ammo on a set that should never happen, particularly because they’re firing blanks and weapons that are there for the effect and not actual ammo used for actual target or actual penetration. So that’s a question that needs to be answered. How did the ammo make it on set? There are a lot of questions here that need to be answered that are not answered. And so we may find as things get fleshed out in the trial, that there are many more people to blame in addition to these two. But right now, 100% of the blame on his shoulders. Well, I’ll be nice. 99% of the blame on his shoulders, maybe 1% on the armor or maybe we could say 5050. Who knows? Either way, both of them have some responsibility in the death of Halyna Hutchins, in my opinion.

Yeah, I agree. I don’t know if I quite agree with the percentage, but I do agree that the armor definitely is to be blamed. Hannah Reid, she definitely bear some of this because you’re the armor, you know, have some answers for this. And to answer the question why she wasn’t there, it was because what they were doing wasn’t what she was told they would be doing. I guess put it that way. You mean the rehearsing, Right? They weren’t even making a take. They were trying to get camera angles. I understand. According to what Alec Baldwin said, it seemed like they were trying to get camera angles and stuff like that. So Halyna was actually trying to tell him, hey, at least according to his words, you know, pointed this way, pointed that way, and he end up and guess she told him to point it at her, I guess trying to get camera angles correct and stuff like that. But definitely I would put some blame on the armorer. You think you asked a good question. We can discuss it a bit later but about the live round but Hannah Reid definitely the armorer to be blamed. Alec Baldwin Definitely to be blamed because as you alluded to, we said that there are four rules of gun safety, but there’s an unspoken rule of gun safety, which is basically believe no one, not even yourself. So if someone hands you a gun and tells you safe or call, always double check, check by making sure that the magazine is empty, there’s no round in the chamber, but looking at physically examine the chamber, make sure that there’s no round in it. Why? Because you’re dealing with a deadly weapon. You know, I’ve gone to the range a couple of times, and when I prepare to go to the range, when I had guns, I have guns. I normally unload them before I go. To the range. But on a recent rain trip, I went to the range and I loaded my magazines and I, you know, pulled the slide to charge the weapon and the round fly out. If you’d asked me before that happened, are these guns empty? Are they cold? I would say, yeah, sure. I always empty them. But there was a round in the chamber that I maybe in haze or whatever the case may be. I didn’t take it out. Yeah, this was before the boating accident, right? Right. So what happened there? Let’s say I was clowning around or something and pointing the gun at somebody pulled the trigger because I’m sure it is cold. Then I would have shot somebody. Yeah, so you just don’t do that with weapons. I remember seeing a YouTube video. I think this video was out of Brazil where these two friends were cleaning their weapons and upon finishing cleaning their weapons, they were putting them back together. Oh, goodness. And the first friend, he sent his slide home and then he put his magazine in it, point the gun at his friends and pulled the trigger. Well, no harm, no foul. I guess nothing happened here. You hear a click instead of a bang because there was no round in the chamber. Well, when his friend was finished with cleaning his gun and put it back together, he inserted the magazine, then sent the slide home, point the gun at his friend. Well, in this situation, I’m going to hear a click. You’re going to hear a bang. You heard a bang. His friend fell over and died because they were playing around with guns. Now you can argue the first friend sent the slide home or put the magazine in first because he know. Okay, right. Doing that way. There will be no bullet in the chamber, but his other friend may just have confused the process or whatever. But it comes down to this just be playing around with the gun. And that’s the issue here. And I know it was a movie set, so maybe it’s a little bit different, but the unspoken rule is just don’t trust anybody. Someone gives you a gun. Make sure you look just to tack on to your story there about the foolishness there.

I have someone very dear to me who recently purchased a weapon and I asked this person if I may see the weapon. This person was being completely just very, very, very unsafe with the weapon, pointing it everywhere. And when I actually checked this person on it and explained to him, you simply can’t treat weapons that way, he mocked me for being a bit too safe and a bit too on edge about weapons. But see, it’s that kind of laxness that gets people accidentally killed. It’s that kind of nonchalance with weaponry that makes everyone unsafe. And when accidents like that happen, you can’t take that back. Helena Hutchins will never come back. This friend in Brazil will never come back. It doesn’t need to happen. And so the idea of weapon safety really needs to be taken a lot more seriously. In this case, obviously, it wasn’t.

Yeah, definitely. Here is Alec Baldwin responding to the criticism he was getting from folks saying he never pointed a loaded gun at anyone

in the aftermath of the shooting. A torrent of criticism. The first thing you do when you pick up that gun is you make sure that it’s never pointed at anybody. He should have known that an aide handing you a gun and saying it’s cold isn’t the same as several people showing you an empty gun. If I were holding that gun, I would have checked it, wouldn’t you? Some people said to me, mean I got countless people online saying, you idiot, you never point a gun at someone. Well, unless you’re told it’s empty and it’s the director of photography who is instructing you on the angle for a shot. We’re going to do. And she and I had this thing in common where we both thought it was empty and. It wasn’t. And that’s not her responsibility. That’s not my responsibility. Whose responsibility is it? Remains to be seen. But there are some who say you’re never supposed to point a gun at anyone on a set no matter what. Well, unless the person is the cinematographer who’s directing me where to point the gun for her camera angle.

Now, I have some issues with that. And of course, when things like this happen, lawyers normally tell you don’t speak publicly and think that I probably should not have, should not, may not make the right decision here. Speaking publicly, I know if you listen to the George Stephanopoulos video, which is on YouTube and also his police interview, which is also on YouTube, I will give him this. They’re pretty much consistent. Of course, they’re a little bit changing in the story, but that’s expected with humans. But in their meat of the matter, he was pretty much consistent. But here what he was saying, basically he was blaming other folks. And I’m not saying that there are not other folks that should be blamed. I think everybody from the assistant director, Dave Halls, everybody in leadership should be blamed for this, not just Alec Baldwin, But Alec Baldwin doesn’t get to deflect blame because he’s the one who pulled the trigger. So whether or not Helena was trying to set him up and kind of get the right angle or whatever the case may be, you have a firearm in your hand, even if you’re dry firing a weapon. If I’m dry, firing a weapon and I put it down or I’m distracted for any amount of time before I dry fire again, I check it even when I have laser bullets in there, because sometimes you want to have something to cushion the hammer or the striker when you’re dry firing. So if you have dummy rounds in there or laser bullet in there to see what your shots are going. Always double check. So it doesn’t matter what Helena did, it doesn’t matter what the Armorer did in this case. Alec Baldwin did some blame that should be placed squarely on your shoulder. I think that he’s absolving himself of all blame in that clip. Yeah.

Yeah. That’s what he come across to me as, like. Okay. I was told he was cold. I’m not the armorer, Helena told me to do this and do that. You’re a grown man. Don’t point a gun at someone, especially a gun that you haven’t double checked. I know what he is. Real or not. I think going forward in movies that maybe they need to have these actors and these stars go through not just what the armorer said, but maybe a full day course of gun safety and how to handle weapons because this is bad. What he said was bad. And I think, of course, that the responsibility fall on the shoulder. I have another clip of Alec Baldwin.

Every single time I’m handed a gun on a set, every time, mark, they hand me a gun, I look at it, I open it, I show it to the person I’m pointing it to. We show it to the crew every single take. You hand it back to the armor. When you’re done, you do it again. Everyone does it. Everybody knows it. How do you respond to actors like George Clooney? You say that every time they were handed a gun, they checked it themselves. Well, there were a lot of people who felt it necessary to contribute some comment to the situation, which really didn’t help the situation at all. You have your if your protocol is you check the gun every time. Well, good for you. Good for you. You know, I probably handled weapons as much as any other actor in films with an average career, again, shooting or being shot by someone. And in that time, I had a protocol and it never let me down. Why did you choose in your 40 years not to check the gun yourself? Well, I was taught by someone years ago was, as I said, if I if I took a gun and I popped a clip out of a gun or I manipulated the chamber of a gun, they would take the gun away from me and redo it. The prop person said, Don’t do that when I was young. And they’d say, One thing you would need to understand is we don’t want the actor to be the last line of defense against a catastrophic breach of safety with the gun. My job, they told me, man or woman, my job is to make sure the gun is safe and then I hand you the gun and I declare the gun safe. The crew is not relying on you to say that it’s safe. They’re relying on me to say that it’s safe when that person who is charged with that job handed me the weapon. I trusted them and I never had a problem. And this was from the beginning of your career, from day one, there’s one person that’s supposed to make sure that what is in the gun is right and what’s wrong is not in the gun. One person has that responsibility to maintain the gun.

Well, he’s right about that. He’s wrong about who is that one person He’s blaming the armorer. Well, he didn’t say. But yeah, I disagree with him. Again, I don’t think it’s one person who has the responsibility to be safe with a gun. Again, I’m no actor and I don’t even play one on TV. But the truth is here, yes, you’re paying someone to make sure that things are safe. That’s the responsibility of the armorer, simply put, to make sure that the handling and firing the weapons are done in a safe manner. That’s why there some blame to be placed here on the armorer. But also, Alec, you cannot take. Blame away from yourself. You were the one who had the gun. You’re the one who allegedly pulled the trigger because the trigger had to be pulled. According to the FBI and according to my knowledge of firearm, which is not that great, but because I’ve put myself around people and may or may not have owned a firearm in the past or may currently own firearm, I know some stuff about firearms. And the thing is, it’s your responsibility was in your hand. Of course, I don’t know about the armorer telling him, Hey, make sure I’m the last person to drop. I can see why the armorer wouldn’t want the actor to drop the magazine. I guess in a sense. But at the same time, if you can’t drop the magazine, I will want the armorer to show me directly that the gun is empty or it is loaded with blanks. I would want to be more personally involved than to give a gun and be heard. That is cold and just take their word at it. I’m not going to take anybody’s word at it. You know, take nobody’s word at it. When they tell you a gun is cold or gun is hot or whatever the case may be, always assume a firearm is loaded. So whether or not that’s the rule in movie set or whatever the case may be, I don’t know. I can’t speak to that. But if you cannot drop the magazine and rack the slide to make sure it is empty because the armorer will want to make sure he’s the last person to have manipulated the gun in terms of whether it has live rounds or not. Well, let them do it in front of you. If they say, look, there’s nothing you can physically check for yourself for your peace of mind, because, look, you’re in this situation because you listen to somebody that didn’t give you good advice.

Right. So I guess we can conclude that that was poor advice because if you had listened to different advice, maybe this would not have happened. Could he be saying that from his producer frame of mind because he was the producer for the film and the producer is responsible for making the hiring decisions in the film, they hire the director. So he would have been the one to have hired the armorer, I would imagine. Maybe he had an assistant or something, but that falls under his responsibility if he’s saying, Well, I’m paying you to make sure that these weapons are accounted for and for you to do all of these things that’s required of armourers and you failed in your duty. And so maybe because he’s the producer, he hired someone to do that job that he should have been doing. Maybe that’s why he’s saying, Oh, well, you know, it’s not my responsibility, only one person. And in his mind when he says one person, we all know that he’s probably talking about the armorer. And so could that be why he’s trying to absolve himself of any blame? Because apparently on a movie set, the things are different when it comes to guns. Apparently, according to Alec Baldwin, Well, he was one of the producers. And again, I don’t know all the things about movies, but he wasn’t the producer, according to what he says in the many interviews I’ve watched with him, at least the two of them, the one with the police and the one with an ABC, he was one of the producers, but the other producer was the other guy that actually got shot, Joel Souza. And he’s the one who was responsible for, according to Baldwin, the hiring and all this stuff. I thought Souza was the director. I think he was a producer. Oh, okay. My bad. I think he was a producer. But we can double check that. He can double check that and let me know. But I think Souza was one of the producers because according to Baldwin, he wasn’t doing any of the hiring and firing and the stuff. He was a producer, but he wasn’t doing any of that stuff. And I assume it’s because he was also an actor. And also, keep in mind, this was a low budget film. So because of that, the armorer, Hannah Reed was not just the armorer, she was also the prop girl or woman. Now that’s a problem. So she should have one job and one job. Well, she had two responsibilities, and I didn’t think she had someone who was helping her as well.

So just real quick here, Joel Souza was the writer and the director who was the other producer. Let’s see here. It says here Alec Baldwin. But I don’t see any others. I’m sure there were some others, but I don’t see any names here. You keep talking and I’ll find it. Yeah. So whatever the case may be, low budget, the armor have double duties and Alec Baldwin not checking and making sure stuff was kosher, if you want to use that term in terms of the firearm it was hanging in and stuff like that. So again, I put blame on Alec Baldwin. I put blame on the armor and I put blame on the people that were in leadership position. They were all responsible for this. And Alec Baldwin break this. Every rules. He trusts fallible men according to his own words, that, hey, they told me not to do this, so I don’t. But you think you brought up a good point, though. Does safety rules go out of the window on a movie set? If you were to ask me, I would say no. But I suppose I can understand how the rules of weapon safety or at least. I can understand how people probably feel that the rules of weapon safety need to be bent just a wee bit on the movie set in order to get the camera angles, in order to get the effects that they’re looking for, in order to get the emotions that they’re trying to evict or solicit from the scene. I suppose I could see I don’t really, but it should be ironclad and it should be a rule across every single scenario, every single situation that the rules of weapon safety don’t change. The reason for that is if you have weapon safety rules for one setting and then weapon safety rule for a different setting, there is no way to guarantee that people know and understand how to handle weapons safely and effectively without accidentally shooting someone dead on the scene or on the workforce. He mentioned Alec Baldwin did that. Helena was directing him where to point the weapon, how to pull the hammer back, what angle to have the muzzle pointing and all of those things. I don’t know if he did this on purpose, but he basically blamed the reason for the weapon being pointed at her was because she directed him to point it toward her. He didn’t say that, but he basically said he was just doing what the cinematographer was telling him to do. I’ve heard him say both that he wasn’t aware that the weapon was pointing at her and that he found out later that it was because obviously she was shot. So obviously it was pointed at her. And I’ve also heard him say that he had no idea where the weapon was being pointed or was pointed at that time. And so if you were to ask me, should the weapons safety rules be the same on a movie set, I would have to say absolutely. Otherwise things like this happen.

Well, first thing I can see, maybe he didn’t know the weapon was being pointed at her because it wasn’t like he had good grip, you know, sight alignment and all these things. He was pulling from the waist and basically shooting at waist level and movies. John Kerry said you can tell when someone has been trained on a weapon and not just based on how they grip the weapon. Of course, many times you see people gripping weapon in the movies. You can tell these people know nothing about weapons. Sure. You know, sometimes I’ll be watching, you know, especially these older movies. And I see people just kind of just pointing their gun in all kind of weird way and shooting people like, you know, that’s not real life. Right? Right. You know, So I could see that he didn’t really know it was per se pointing at her. I guess you can say he was pointing in her direction, from what I understand is that usually they don’t point the weapon at the person. They shoot the pointed kind of off, but then it’s still pointing in the opposite direction. But I think we will disagree on this one, Jay, because I do think that the rules of firearm safety go out of the window on a movie set. I know it can be a little bit dicey and, you know, to violate the rules of firearm safety. But in order to get the real, real life effect that they want to get, you have to put the rules out of the window. Again, it’s going to sound like I’m contradicting myself here, but sometime I think gun people sometimes get too antsy with the rules of gun safety. Like, for instance, many striker fire weapons like your Glocks and your M2 shield. None of these weapons you have to deactivate the sear in order to feel stripped them. Now, the easiest way to do it? Well, not for Glock Glocks. You have to pull the trigger to feel strip it for your Beretta and your Smith and Wesson and think about your striker fire weapons. I don’t know of any of them that you don’t have to fire the weapon to feel strip it. Now, I know Beretta and Smith and Wesson tell you that you can actually use something like a screwdriver or something as small stuff and you can disengage the sear using that so you don’t have to pull the trigger. But these are so easy to pull the trigger if you feel strip in it, you know? So there you violate a rule of firearm safety right there if you pull the trigger because you should never pull the trigger according to firearm safety again, most of the time when you after you clean your weapon and stuff like they put it back together, most people will do a function check and that function check, including pull the trigger on a dry or empty chamber. So there are times when you violate the rules of firearm safety. I’m not talking about these clowns that will go to gun range and turn on their camera and hold guns to their head and hold guns to their friend’s head just because they want to take a picture of video of them with a gun on the range. I’m not talking about that. I’m not saying we do things with weapons all the time that say that we will violate these rules. So these rules are not necessarily that you never, ever do these things, at least in my opinion. There are some people that are paranoid enough. I guess paranoid is not the right word, but there are some people that will take their gun to a gunsmith or whatever to clean it because they don’t want to pull the trigger to. Field trip it and there are people that are like that. They’d never pull the trigger for any reason except, I guess for in terms of life and death or grievous bodily injury where you’re defending yourself, but that again, you’re violating the rules of have safety. If you’re shooting a bad guy to save your life again, it might be warranted, but you’re still violating the rules of firearm safety because you’re pointing the gun at somebody and you’re pulling the trigger. So there are times I guess my point is that you need to violate the rules of fire safety. And of course, if you’re going to do that, always do it in a safe manner.

So if you’re cleaning your weapon, one, make sure there’s no live ammo around you. Two, make sure that you check and make sure the gun is empty before you dry fire it so you can feel strip it. And the only legal and reasonable time that you point your firearm at somebody and pull the trigger as if you’re defending your life or yourself from death or grievous bodily injury. But other than that, follow the rules of firearm safety. But in a movie set, I would imagine the reason why they go to such lengths of using Plexiglas and using blanks and using dummy rounds is because they want the real effect. So of course you’re going to have to violate the rules of safety. But at least in this point. Alec Baldwin Again, I still stand by what I say. He should have double checked. He should have known the condition of his weapon.

But it begs the question, as you brought up earlier, how did live rounds get on the set? Oh, goodness. That is the million dollar question. In this particular case. I don’t know if it even matters because the rules of weapon safety were not followed. I don’t even think it matters in terms of assigning blame. But that is a very important question. Many of the crew members testify, or at least they have said publicly it hasn’t gone to trial yet, but they have said publicly that the weapons safety concerns were ignored and that the rules were so lax on set that people were taking the props, these guns and just practicing target shooting on set like in a makeshift range, I would imagine, because the set itself was set in New Mexico in a deserted sort of remote area in the desert somewhere. And so you could set up a makeshift range if you really wanted to. And they were apparently practicing shooting cans out off the side or at the back. I don’t know how the set was set up, but if that were the case, the ammo for that weapon could have come from absolutely anyone on the set, not just the armorer. If they were using the props for target practice just to kill time, those rounds could have come from anywhere. And by the way, there were 12 producers total, including Alec Baldwin, whether they were executive or line producers, there were 12 of them total, six producers, including Alec Baldwin. The six others were either executive or line producers. And so if he’s blaming all of those guys, he’s going to have to. I’m blaming them. Oh, you’re blaming them. Okay. I didn’t realize. Okay. So. Well, yeah, they certainly have responsibility because they are responsible for not only who’s being hired, but also how things are conducted or how things are carried out on set. Actually, you know, it was Dave Halls. Dave Halls. Okay. I think it’s Dave Hall listed as a producer. Let’s see. I think I said Joel Souza. He’s the one who got shot in the shoulder. Yes, the director. But Dave Halls was also a producer because one of these guys, Dave Halls, actually have pled guilty. Yes. And I think he’s going to be testifying against Baldwin in upcoming. Yeah, he was the assistant director, one of these guys. But Dave Hall was the assistant director of the case. Maybe I’m blaming all of them. All of them? Yeah, all of them. Right. And so if they were using the props for target practice on the set, those rounds really could have come from anywhere because that means that the armorer did not have possession and accountability for those weapons. If that’s the case. Well, according to her testimony to the police, because she also gave her testimony to the police, is that the guns were locked away in a safe and only herself. And another lady that was helping her had access to the safe. The ammunition was not locked away. So I don’t know if that allegation is true, that they were actually dry. Firing or firing weapons on the set could be true. I couldn’t find anyone that testified to that, whether it’s Alec Baldwin or Hannah Reed or anyone. So I don’t know if that’s true or not. Maybe you have more information on that than I do, but it could just be disgruntled crew members. It could be. But I didn’t find any information on that in terms of they were actually doing that because that would be concerning because she was actually saying she didn’t know how live round get into the ammo box because she double check it either before lunch or after lunch or whatever the case. Maybe she was surprised that there were live rounds on the set. So either she’s a good liar or she just really doesn’t know where the live round came from.

I think it’s a very important question. I don’t think it changed anything in terms of Alec Baldwin responsibility, the armor responsibility. But what he. Does is that it will tell us if they were intent here. Did someone have intention to harm someone on the set? That’s where I guess answer me this question might come into play in terms of why would someone put a live round in a box of blank ammunition or was it a defect from the manufacturers? Who knows? You know, because, you know, maybe you have a oh, you mean like straight from the manufacturing, from the factory? There was a live round, Right? Maybe accidental. An accidental live round in the box of blanks. That could be the case, too. I don’t know. I don’t know if any of our listeners that know much more about firearms than I do. Have you ever found a live round in the box of blanks? Because the Armorer was surprised and Alec was a surprise and whatever the case may be, I don’t know if that’s the case. It’d be interesting to hear to see if the FBI has seized all the ammo, the blank ammo that was on set, if they find any more live rounds. Because if you have intention whosoever that may be, why would they just only put one blank round one live round? The probability of that is so low that that weapon has how many six cylinders is that weapon? I would assume 6 or 5. I guess my question is, so there are a lot of points of failure here, right? Because blank rounds don’t look like live rounds, number one. Well, she didn’t know and clearly no one checked. So that wouldn’t have mattered. They wouldn’t have seen it anyway. But also, number two, if this were a defect from the manufacturer, i.e. the accidentally put a live round in a box of blanks, I don’t see how that would be the fault of the manufacturer, although I guess you could put some blame there. But it’s still the armourer’s job to maintain control and accountability of both the round and the ammo. And it’s also the person who has the gun in their hand. In this case, Alec Baldwin, the actor. It’s their responsibility to check and make sure that the weapon is actually in the condition that the armorer says that it is. So there are many points of failure here. It’s almost like the Titanic, just many points of failures that led to the actual moment of death in this case for Helena Hutchins. Yeah, I totally agree. I’m the armorer, definitely. Alec Baldwin Definitely. But I think in our human minds, we would like to know how that live got there, because it does make a small difference, at least in this case, because they’re charged with, what, felony manslaughter, manslaughter and some other kind of manslaughter. Two counts, what is it? Involuntary manslaughter and involuntary manslaughter in the commission of a lawful act. So according to that, I would say, yeah, definitely. And both of them have been charged. It’s not like they just charge Alec Baldwin, both of them in charge, and both of them will have their day in court. But I hope evidence come out, if they have any. And who brought live rounds, as you said, Were they firing the weapons on the makeshift range on the set? Is that true? And all that stuff? Because we would like to get that question answered about the live round. But at the end of the day, the only thing you change is that who else do we need to charge? That’s that’s the only thing that change here because I don’t think it remove Alec Baldwin and the armor responsibility it might say okay then oh we need to charge the manufacturer, maybe not even charge the manufacturer, but to the manufacturer of the box, whoever created that. Or we need to find this disgruntled employee that maybe left the day before that decided they’re going to sabotage and put one single live round in the box. It doesn’t make sense to me, so I don’t know how are they being charged with two counts of manslaughter if only one person died as a result of the incident? There’s two different counts. One is involuntary manslaughter and involuntary manslaughter with the commission of a Lawful act. And I think.

Oh, I see. So it’s two different counts. I’ll come back to that. But here is Alec Baldwin talking about an accident. That very same question about the live round and what is the actor’s responsibility. I guess that’s a that’s a tough question because the actor’s responsibility going this day forward is very different than it was the day before that. Now, I can’t. First of all, I can’t imagine I’d ever do a movie that had a gun in it again. And I can’t. When you say what is the actor’s responsibility? The actor’s responsibility is to. Do what the prop armorer tells him to do. And we did not have a problem. I mean, I understand there was an accidental discharge at one point on the set of a blank round, but we did not have a problem for me until that day. Everything gets slowed down. The Zapruder film is here. And the issue with that is there’s only one question to be resolved, only one, and that is where did the live round come from? I don’t think I don’t think that’s true. Alec, I don’t think that’s the only one. I’ll give you That is a big one. But I don’t think it changed. As I said, the only thing it changes is that who else do we need to charge for the debt and the wounding of these Helena and Joel. I’m horrified by his absolute refusal to accept any responsibility for this. He’s in the same class of people. I’m talking about Hollywood elites, leftists that would lecture us about how we don’t need guns and how guns are dangerous and you need to know how to handle a gun, blah, blah, blah. All of these things that affect the laws of guns in this country. But he himself absolutely unwilling to take any responsibility for what happened on that set that day.

All right. Well, we’ll take a break and then we’ll come back and we will talk some more about Alec Baldwin and gun safety. We’ll be right back.

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All right. So, Jay. Do you think that it change anything that they were safety concerns repeatedly brought up by the crew members on the set? Yeah, I think I’m no lawyer and I can’t pretend to be one on the radio, but they could perhaps take the fact that these concerns appear to have been ignored. They could take that fact and demonstrate, at the very least, negligence. And a good lawyer might even be able to demonstrate malice. That’s a very serious thing when you’re dealing with firearms of any capacity to be flippant or not to be careful with safety or not to be diligent in executing all manner of safety rules. I think that in court, exactly how these concerns were ignored, both brought up and ignored, will be fleshed out. It will know a lot more. But on the surface, it doesn’t change the fact that he’s responsible and the armor is responsible. And so many people here are responsible. It doesn’t change any of that. But I think in the courtroom it will change things because, as I said, they can use that to demonstrate intent, perhaps, or negligence, malice, that sort of thing. Yeah, I agree definitely that in court, criminal or civil, I think they already circled the civil part of this. So definitely in court. Definitely going to come up and a good prosecutor is definitely going to use that to show and prove that this is not necessarily an accident per se, but a pattern of behavior, which is like fuel on the fire in court. Yeah. And from what I understand, there was bad blood on set. This has not been confirmed. This is probably he said she said. But apparently there are groups of people on that set within the crew that didn’t get along, particularly the ones that brought these concerns up, the ones who were concerned about their pay, concerned about the lack of sleep, concerned about being set up an hour away from the set to drive an hour to come to set, and they have to work for 12, 13, 14, 15 hours. However long actors and filmmakers and film crew have to work and then drive an hour back and only getting five hours of sleep. And everyone’s running on very, very, very tight rope in terms of energy and in terms of personal relationships, interpersonal relationships. And so the fact that there was bad blood on set could also change things as well. I don’t know what you think about that. Yeah, Well, let’s point on that. That’s that’s alleged. I’m quite sure that’s true. But definitely we know that based upon evidence that have come out thus far that you mention it, lack of sleep driving so far to get on set and all that stuff. We know that half of the crew are even more quit in terms of the film crew quit the day before and stuff like that. So we know that there was some stuff going on there that caused some guess. I don’t know if bad blood is the right word, but disgruntled employees, I guess it might be a better term. But whatever the case may be there, I don’t see much evidence to say that it was enough bad blood for someone to swap out. Again, it just amazing to me to swap out one live round. So I don’t know, I guess when it come out to court, we might realize that the FBI found a box of live rounds someplace. Who knows? I don’t know that to be a fact, but it’s kind of weird that it was only one, and that’s still baffling to me. And of course, you know, we talk about this, but and of course, we talk about the involuntary manslaughter and involuntary manslaughter while in the commission of a lawful act.

Do you think this is more of a civil matter or a criminal matter? What would you say? I think it’s definitely criminal. The negligence for sure is criminal. See, this is where we don’t know the heart of man. We don’t know if we can attach any or assign any malice or any intent there. I don’t think that he intended to shoot anyone. Well, they didn’t charge him with intent. That’s why he’s involuntary manslaughter. Right. And so but the negligence, the level of negligence here and the fact that someone was killed as a result of gross negligence certainly makes that criminal. You think there should be charges against him? Were they warranted? For sure, yes. He seems to swear up and down that that shouldn’t be the case. But absolutely the charges are warranted, in my opinion. I could be very wrong about that. What do you think? Yeah, I think, again, I think the civil matters are already circled from what I understand. You mean between him, civil matter and the family is already settled? I think that’s already settled. But the criminal matter is still coming up, still waiting for that court case. And I’ll probably be watching some of it or most of it and see what comes out. I’m curious especially about the live on the anything come out of that. But I think Alec Baldwin did not do himself any justice again by speaking to the police and going on ABC to talk again, which we have played several clips from it. I have another one to play again, but I don’t think he did himself an injustice because I think some of the things that they’re going to hold him on is what he said to the. Police on what he said on TV. And again, for most part, he was pretty much consistent. But at the same time, he probably did not make any sense because he said he did not pull the trigger. Again, the FBI said that the gun could have be fired without the trigger. For me, again, I mentioned this earlier for a little bit of firearm that I know because it was a single action revolver. He cocked the arm all the way back. That trigger is very light. He could have accidentally pulled the trigger. And there were, again, pictures of him floating around on the Internet showing it with his finger on the trigger. I think he had incriminate himself more by the amount of talking he has done than if he had just kept his mouth shut. And that’s what lawyers tell you. You know, if you’re in any shooting situation, whether it is self-defense, clearly self-defense, tell the police, hey, I would love to have a talk with you after I speak to my counsel because I don’t think he should have kept his mouth shut. But here is Alec Baldwin saying he didn’t pull the trigger and some other things.

This was a completely incidental shot, an angle that may not have ended up in the film at all. But we kept doing this anyway. So then I said to her, Now in this scene, I’m going to cock the gun. And I said, Do you want to see that? And she said, Yes. So I take the gun and I start to cock the gun. I’m not going to pull the trigger. I said, Do you see that? She goes, Well, just cheat it down and tilt it down a little bit like that. And I cock the gun. Go, Can you see that? Can you see that? Can you see that? And she says, And then I let go of the hammer of the gun and the gun goes off. I let go of the hammer. The gun, the gun goes off. At the moment, the decisive. That was the moment the gun went off. Yeah, that was the moment the gun went off. It wasn’t in the script for the trigger to be pulled. Well, the trigger wasn’t pulled. I didn’t pull the trigger. So you never pulled the trigger? No, no, no, no, no. I would never point a gun at anyone and pull a trigger at them. Never. Never. That was the training that I had. You don’t point a gun at me and pull the trigger on day one of my instruction in this business, people said to me, Never take a gun and go, click, click, click, click, click. Because even though it’s incremental, you damaged the firing pin on the gun. If you do that, don’t do that. And Hall’s attorney told ABC News that he was watching and agrees that Alec did not pull the trigger and that his finger was outside the trigger guard. So you have this Colt 45. You just pulled the hammer as far back as I could without cocking the actual. And you’re holding on to the hammer. I’m holding. I’m just showing. How about that? Does that work? Do you see that? Do you see that? Do you see that? She goes, Yeah, that’s good. I let go of the hammer, Bang. The gun goes.

You see, I have many issues with that. Again, because he said he pulled the hammer far back as you go with a cock in the gun. Now, I don’t have a Colt 45 revolver, but from my experience with Revolver, because they have different positions of the hammer, once you pull it back, it doesn’t just fly forward when you let it go. It actually stays wherever the last position it was at. If it clicks in place. Right. He’s saying that he. Well, yeah, he did say those were his words. He pulled it back as far as it could go. As far as it could go. Would be it clicking in place? Exactly. I think he perhaps thought that he pulled it back as far as he could go. And I believe him when he said he didn’t pull the trigger. Now, I believe that he didn’t physically have an action to pull the trigger. I think that when he let the hammer go, the trigger was already depressed. This is how the old Westerns, you ever see them? Like how they would hold the gun, They would just slam the hammer back and make the gun shoot faster. Bang, bang, bang, bang, bang. You would see them doing this particular action if you’re holding the trigger, depressing the trigger in any way. When you do that, the gun will go off. I think when he drew that weapon, his finger was already on the trigger. He didn’t do any additional movement to pull the trigger so that when he did let the hammer go, the hammer hits the firing pin. The trigger is already depressed and bang. I think that’s what happened. That’s a possibility to actually going to actually test that on someone’s revolver since I lost all mines, but that the possibility that the trigger was depressed and he pulled the hammer all the way back and he fly forward. And that’s the only that’s the only other way I can think that the hammer fly home when you pull it all the way back. Because otherwise it doesn’t make any sense that you say you pull it all the way back, but you didn’t pull the trigger. So. So he must have pulled it as far back as he can pull it without it clicking in place. Will it fly forward at that point? See me. I’m more of a semi-automatic modern weapon. I don’t do revolvers. I don’t know much about them. So could that have been like, could he have been pulling it back and holding it in place without it clicking back like. Like, see, I’ve never test that, but I would imagine that it probably would. But if he lets it go because it didn’t click in the full position, because it didn’t click into the full cocked position, it flew forward with that force. And that’s a possibility. That’s a possibility. But whatever the case may be, it still doesn’t remove his responsibility.

Sure. Yeah, it doesn’t change anything. He whatever it is, he had to do something to trigger what? His finger was already on the trigger and the trigger was all the way back or the trigger Being a single action was very light. And he didn’t realize that the mere whatever he may do would have fired a gun. Right. £3 is nothing. Again, I’ve gone through the range with revolvers, fired them in double action, then put them in single action and the shot break before I thought he was going to break because the trigger is extremely light and single action, you know? So that’s what it is.

You know, this is obviously we’re talking about this here today because it’s a huge point of conversation in this is a well known actor in Hollywood and someone has died as a result of this. And he’s insisting that he’s not responsible, that he didn’t do it, he didn’t pull the trigger. It’s somebody else’s fault. I can’t help but wonder, had this been anyone else, some no name citizen, things would have gone completely different. Somebody would be in jail right now and there certainly wouldn’t be a lot of discussion back and forth about how could this have happened, gun safety and all that sort of thing. I think because it’s a big name actor and because this happened in Hollywood or under the umbrella of Hollywood, that this is the aftermath is what it is that we see today. I wonder what that says about our society. I wonder what that says about us. Like Hollywood operates with its own set of rules and everyone else, the little peons down here operate by a different set of rules. I’m not sure if that’s an indictment on us as a people, as a nation that points to some kind of spiritual deficiency that we’re looking to Hollywood for. I suppose guidance or the standard is the better term of how we are to behave or how we are to do things. Alec Baldwin Even before this was very vocal about his support for gun control and for regular people or citizens not having weapons available to them. And so now that this has happened to him, this conversation, I believe, will inevitably trickle into our lives in terms of how lawmakers and how the elite, as it were. I put that in quotation marks, are going to view the gun handling issue again as a result of this. I wonder what that means for us as a people, because if this were any yojo on the street, we wouldn’t even be talking about this. But every single year, countless and I don’t know the numbers, but I’m sure it is many, many, many, many incidents of negligent discharges happen, people being affected. Did by this sort of thing. And so naturally, this is something that we need to talk about because weapon safety is something that everyone should know, not just a select group of people, not just the armourer that’s on the set, not just people that we deem, okay, that’s your job. You worry about gun safety. Every single citizen should know and understand and practice weapon safety. I don’t know if that’s what’s going to happen as a result of this. It seems like as a result of this, we’re going to decide that, see, weapons can’t be handled safely by anyone. And so there’s going to be a push for more gun control. We’re going to perhaps there are spiritual implications as well in terms of the person. Does it make sense of what I’m trying to say?

Yeah, Hollywood kind of shaped society. If you want to see what direction the society is going, you think you can look at Hollywood? I don’t think Hollywood necessarily shape society more than society kind of shape Hollywood. You know, if you go back to the sitcoms of the 60s and the 70s, you’re talking about your Andy Griffith Show and stuff like that. They were much cleaner sitcoms compared to today. And Hollywood changed the society or the society changed Hollywood. Of course, I’m not defending Hollywood. Hollywood is a cesspool of filth, but you can see that society is going the same direction. If you want to know what’s going on in society, watch Disney. Watch. What’s coming out of Hollywood is the epitome of what’s going on in society today. You want to know what political climate is of the country? Look at Hollywood as well. But I think it’s more there. People kind of shaping Hollywood want Hollywood shaping the people. But I think there’s some truth in the fact that Hollywood is shaping the people, too, in terms of what it was a Joe, nobody caused this. Would this be important? I think if it was a draw, nobody, they would have still been charged. I think the difference is that would we have heard about it? Absolutely not, because as you said, negligent discharges and all these things happen all the time. We have, again, I mentioned many, many examples we have seen on YouTube and what people clown around with weapons that they shouldn’t. So I don’t think it’s necessarily true because he’s Alec Baldwin while he’s being charged. He could be. He’s Alec Baldwin. Why he’s taking so long because this was 2020 1st October. This have been well over a year, actually. You have just been formally charged this year. So you know what’s taking that? It could be because of him, but it could be because they want to do due diligence before they charge him with this, because he’s a man of means. So that means he’s going to get good lawyers. They’re going to maybe drag this out in court or plead down or whatever. The case may be important here. They said we mentioned that he was charged with involuntary manslaughter in New Mexico. This is what manslaughter is. Manslaughter is the unlawful killing of a human being. Without malice, Then they have what they call voluntary manslaughter, voluntary manslaughter.

This is New Mexico law. Voluntary manslaughter consists of manslaughter committed upon a sudden quarrel or in the heat of passion. Whoever commits voluntary manslaughter is guilty of third degree felony, resulting in the death of a human being. And then, of course, part B is involuntary. Manslaughter consists of manslaughter committed in the Commission of Unlawful Act, not amounting to felony or in the Commission of a Lawful act, which might produce death in an unlawful manner or without due caution and circumspection. Whosoever commit involuntary manslaughter is guilty of first degree felony. And that’s exactly what Alec Baldwin is and Hannah Reed is facing. But I think the root of the issue, again with society and we have stars and all these things is because we have respect of person, we respect people based on their social status or whatever the case may be. And we can argue until the cows come home, whether or not, you know, we have all these groups like Black Lives Matter and all these things, and but no matter what country you’re in, they go, I was going to be a class system. They’re always going to be some sort of class system. In the US, we like to claim that there is no class system, but there is a class system of the rich or the have and have not. You know, we have seen many times where because of the respect of person, a lot of folks that maybe should be in jail and not in jail, aka Hillary Clinton. Tell them how you really feel. You know, I’m not it’s not necessarily I don’t make it too political, but I’m simply saying, if I had done with classified documents what Hillary Clinton did, I would be in jail. If I had done what Donald Trump did with classified documents, I would be in jail if I had done what Mike Pence did with his classified document, whether knowingly or unknowingly, for these men. I would be in jail if I had done what Joe Biden did with classified documents, I would be in jail. So. That’s Democrats and Republicans, too, if any. No Name Joe had accidentally brought classified documents home. They will be in jail, if any. Nobody had put government email on a private server, they would be in jail. And for majority of my career, I have been a government contractor, so I know a little bit about government email because I have a.gov email address. So every year, and I’m talking about this because mine is coming up, I have to do another training and another stuff. Don’t do this with government equipment. Don’t do this. Make sure you do this, do this. Sign your life away on all these things. Because why? If you violate it, you’re going to be either civilly or criminally punished and they tell you how much to charge is going to be in all these things. You want to tell me Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump and Mike Pence and Joe Biden didn’t know these things when I as a know Joe, have to go through all these training every year. And I’m not saying it’s the same training every year. So in the respect of person A Joe, nobody definitely I think he will still be in charge, at least in this circumstance. But the difference is it would not be under local media. It would be under national media. CNN and Fox News and all these places would not care about it.

But you know, what I like about my God and savior is that he doesn’t have respect of person. You know, he came to this sin, cursed earth. He gave up the splendor of heaven to die on the cross in my place, a Joe nobody. And that is the beautiful thing about my God, he would have died for you. Even though you’re not an elite, even though you’re not a one percenter, even though you might not even have a network to speak of, he would have died for you. He would still given up heaven for you, for your filth, for your sin. And he took him up on himself. Now, as I said, I’m a no name podcaster, but Jesus did that. For me. He did that for you? He died in my place. He died in your place? Again, one of my favorite verse, second Corinthians 521. For he had made him to be sin for us who knew no sin. That we might be made the righteousness of God in him. Every time I read a verse, every time I quote that verse, after I quote it or read it, the word that comes to my mind is Wow. For he had made him to be sin for us who knew no sin. That we might be made the righteousness of God in Him. He took my guilt and gave me his righteousness. He took my sins upon himself and gave me his glory. He met the satisfaction of the Father. The father demand perfection. The father demand total obedience to his command. The father demand a spotless lamb. I could not have met that. But he met it and he took my punishment upon him. Now the father beckoned to us because of all that. That we should repent. Repent of our sins and turn to Christ. The Bible tells us in Acts Chapter eight, verse 22. Repent ye therefore, of this thy wickedness and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart might be forgiven thee. Acts 319 says Repent ye therefore, and be converted that your sins may be blotted out when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord. In order for you to be saved. Jesus said, I tell you nay, but except he repent, ye shall all likewise perish. Would you repent of your sins and turn to Christ today?

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